Slowest 800 time to break 3:30 for 1500?

In the past I would agree with this logic 100% but the event has completely shifted. We are no longer in the era of the 800/1500m runner, now the 15/3k/5k runner.

The athletes also know how to the execute the race better ie. being disciplined to run just above your threshold for the first 3/4 of the race is far more effective than blasting out the first 400, settling in for the second lap and then trying to reestablish pace in the 3rd - (56,56,56 for 1200m vs 54.5,57.5,56), and because of this they don't need to be as fast over 800m and have the same anaerobic power needed to run a good 2 lapper.

Mo Farah ran 1.48.24 officially for the 800m and yes this was in 2008 and he ran under 3.29 almost 5 years later so hard to say he stayed in just 1.48 form. But he was also only a 13.08 guy back then by 2015 he had run 12.53 so it's fair to suggest he wasn't focussing on his 800 to do this. Maybe in 2013 he could have broken 1.48 (I think he might have been a half second quicker) but also maybe not given his massive increase in mileage and threshold work under Salazar.

In no world could Farah run under 1.47 - and he ran under 3.29. And even if Farah could have run 1.47 and change, he certainly wasn't a 12.3X 5k guy.

You were not that fast ;)

I wasn't - but I was fast enough to know how hard it was/is ;)

Touché ;)

Anybody that can run a 55 second 400 can understand just how hard a sub-3:30 is.

One of my favorite metrics of progression for myself as a runner was how long I could manage sub-60 quarters back to back in a race. At my peak I could do 3. That certainly gave me a good understanding of how difficult it would be to break 4:00. I imagine you could apply a similar logic to 3:30 (for me, I could barely do that for 800, with a running start in a relay).

The PRs you listed don't mean anything, but the thing that surprised me about Geb's 800 times is that he ran 1:49 2 days before 3:32, and 1:50 a week after 3:31 (or maybe vice versa), so his 800s were probably pretty close to what he was capable of. That'd give him a 3-3.5s differential right? He's Geb, and ran 26:22 that year, so it's probably about as small of a difference as anyone's gonna get.

I knew he broke a ton of WRs and brought them down to pretty much modern levels, but I don't think I've really looked at his results in a few years. I probably just lacked the context then that I have now, hence the surprise at his 800/1500 times.

I think it's unlikely he breaks 3:30 this season, but based on his close, a 3:31-2 wouldn't surprise me. And if he can run that in college, I think a 3:29 in the next few years isn't a crazy expectation now that like every Diamond League 1500 is sub-3:30. It also wouldn't surprise me if he never ran a 1500 that was won in sub-3:30 though.

Yeah, that's why I brought up the Geb comparison. He is the high 12:30s guy, but with 1:49 speed, which is probably why he maxed out at 3:31. 1:47 probably is the absolute minimum, but you'd need to be capable of 12:3x/26:2x.

I think Farah could've run 1:47 when he ran 3:28. Didn't he close a 10k in 1:48? I think he leveled up his speed under AlSal, along with his fitness. Farah going from a literal "who" to Olympic champ must have gotten at least .25s better at 800.

Cram did more than "dabble" in the 800. He did run 1:42 high and ran the 800 at Euros (86) and the Olympics (88).

BUT BUT....... how can Jakob run low 3:27 if he is only a mid 1:46 Man?

Am convinced the reason these milers don't race 800 is because it would show just how slow there base/pure speed is relative to longer events.....and they don't want to give psychological ammunition to their competition. Many are convinced there are suspicious reasons El Guerrouj never raced the 800.....or a 1,000m. Even as a tune up for a major championship. Think about that.

Mo Farah ran 1:48.69 in 2003 when he was FOCUSING on 800. There is no factual evidence he would have ever run faster than that in his 3:28 year. Name an 800 runner Salazar coached successfully?

He focused on the 1500 and was so good at it, he could drop down to 800 and do some good time trials and select medal races. Compared to his 1500 it's dabbling.

Coe was more serious about the 800. I take it back about Ovett though, he may have won a medal but rarely raced 800 and wasn't even good at it. PB 1:44.09

Taoufik Makhloufi was the best even 800/1500 runner in a long long time

He's a 5000m runner so he's probably never running 3:29.xx

Clayton Murphy?

Yeah I mean my post preemptively agreed with you - I think when he was in 3.28 shape (the "quickest" he ever was) I think it's plausible he could have run somewhere between 1.47.5 and 1.48.0. That race he went through in low 1.51's so he's right in that 3.5-4 second differential where any less I don't know is going to be possible (historically we don't have any examples thereof). This is also why in todays era I still think you can be a 1.48.5 guy and break 3.30 but no slower.

I didn't say it was a rule that a runner had to be capable of 1:45 or better, only that Willis gave an indication of what we might expect, as another poster had suggested. That is quite apart from the fact that most top athletes will be doped today, which is how slower athletes can run faster times. Like Jakob.

That is an apt description, because Gebrsellasie never won the WCC Championships, despite several tries.