Grant Fisher on Let's Run. EPIC Interview

Yes this was an incredible interview from both sides.

Letsrun folks did a very good job with their questions and more so letting Grant speak. He is a very special athlete and person.

Glad it is available for fans to listen to and absorb - for free!

If I could, I would take back my initial remark about interviews not being free and user name title rub.

I don't know why people characterize this as an obsession?

Consumer driven western cultures are filled with people that react in a reflexive fashion when someone else deviates from the norm. In this case, Quigley's self-promotion and interpersonal dealings changed the chemistry of the team. This is really no different than an office where someone gets a promotion - some are congratulatory, others are put out, and still others get vindictive and petty. What about the neighborhood where a guy buys a shiny new $75,000 pick up? Some think it's cool and enjoy seeing someone get a new rig, others start talking s**t and making up reasons to hate the guy.

Pro runners are just people and people feel increasingly entitled and envious these days. Why did she get the promotion? I work harder and went to a better college! How did he afford that new house because I don't have that sort of money? It's not fair! I am a faster runner, but that girl went to The ESPYs and got to meet celebrities!

No one is promoting Coleen Quigley. These recently departed Bowerman athletes are merely confirming some of the personal dynamics within the team that affected group unity and drove divisions.

Epic interview.

So much insight from Grant Fisher. Wish I could articulate thoughts and feelings half as well as he can.

After listening and doing my best to absorb all that he said, it is clear he is is own Man. He exuded enthusiasm and steely-eyed focus on what he feels he needs to do to be on the podium.

It is little wonder that Grant wants to create a training and racing system around himself when taking into account his educational background centered around data, coding, risk assessment, optimization of results based on such.

His new coach isn’t new to Grant. As Grant stated, he and his coach are working together in a collaborative environment built on years of trust and success when they worked together in High School. That kind of relationship doesn’t go dormant as I am sure they have kept in close contact through his University and BTC days.

Incorporating science (LT training) as Grant stated is something that he understands and is learning more about. His coach (Mike) had him doing that kind of training in High School. Perhaps that is why Grant performed so well off of such low mileage. It was also interesting and very telling when Grant spoke about his University training being very conservative. That Chris Miltenberg held him back and focused on Grants long term development beyond University. Grant is an incredible talent and thankfully those two guys recognized that and didn’t try and squeeze more out of him during those years.

Grant also used the words happy and stress several times. Sounds like he is very happy in his current set up and doesn’t have the stress of being in an environment that changed and wasn’t best suited for his future.

Wishing him the best and looking forward to seeing him on the podium in Paris.

Good to know Grant is so comfortable putting down roots in an extreme red state.

I listened for free last night

This is a great interview. I just listened to it for the first time. I was warned that it would come out but I didn’t know when. I loved it. Grant is an articulate young man who knows where he wants to go.
On occasion, I read these boards. I used to post all the time but I have not done that in the past few years. No matter, I’m posting now. A few people have encouraged me to post so I am.
As a Coach, I see progression as a gradual thing. When I first got Grant, he did EVERYTHING the way I told him to do it. You try it the way I know works, and then as you progress, things may change. Well, usually between Junior and Senior year, the body changes, the mind changes, and the training changes. It HAS to change. You match the training to the athlete. Not the other way around. Grant really began this change at the end of his Sophomore year. At the state meet that year, Grant should have won the mile (against the defending Champion) but the crowd was going crazy and the defending champ got past Grant in the final meter. Yes, the last step. It was a photo finish and Grant didn’t come out on top. Immediately, he and I left the stadium to go jog. We talked. He had the two mile ahead and we needed to get out of the noise and regain focus. Grant came back and won the two mile. I tell that story because it shows Grant’s true strength. His mental focus. Grant’s number one strength is his mind.
Fast forward to his Jr and Sr year. Grant and I started ‘discussing’ race plans, not dictating to them. I was writing all the training to match what he wanted (body performance wise) to come out in the races. But for race planning, we set a plan, we agree to a plan, and Grant executes the plan. There is no hesitation when it comes to follow through. And sometimes, we discuss ‘what ifs’ and ‘then whats’ but we eventually come up with a plan that we think will get him to the medal stand. And that is exactly the way I believe it should be. By the time Grant got to Stanford, we had experimented with many different race plans. All to gain knowledge of how he can best win the race.
So, for Grant to say, ‘I wanted a bit more control over my training,’ that is exactly what we are doing now. We sit down weekly to discuss plans. We adjust training weekly (and even WITHIN a workout if needed) often. We use lactate several times; per workout. His plan is written out through the important races of the year; he sets the races, WE set the plan.
None of this is new to Grant, we used it back in his teens. And while training is simple when you watch it, it’s incredibly complex when you train all the different systems of the body properly.
Grant didn’t really go into training much in the interview but I’m fine sharing our training with others. I love the fact that Jakob shares his stuff. Jakob has made lactate testing cool! The only problem with sharing stuff is that people pick one or two things from the plan and try them. And I’m sure they can complete them. But training is like a puzzle, you have to have ALL the pieces, not just one day, to see the PROGRAM. That is where it gets difficult. People see one day and either compliment or criticize but they are not seeing the program. They are looking at one day. I’m a results oriented Coach. If the results are good, I like the program. If the results are not good, the program has to change. This is non-negotiable.
The thing that is also non-negotiable is attendance at practice. I don’t know if Grant has ever missed a practice. He hasn’t with me. He gets his rest, he eats properly, he comes prepared to do the work, then during warm up, he gets his mind ready for the work day. And we get to work. This alone sets him apart from 99% of the others who watch him on TV. And it HAS to be this way. You cannot improve if you are not training. You will not improve if you don’t rest (on easy days). This is all very simple. Yet, execution day after day, year after year, is very difficult.
Lastly, I don’t mind talking training principles. I do it daily with coaches all over the country. There are many HS athletes out there that have no idea that I’m coaching their coach. I’m fine with that. I wish every athlete would run shocking times. Then, it would be harder and more challenging for me (and the guys I currently coach) to beat those ‘other fast guys.’ I like the pressure of making sure we’re doing things properly; day after day; with focus and intent. And I don’t mind talking training at all. But again, the training MUST match the athlete. Not the other way around.
In summary, the interview was fantastic to listen to. Looking forward to ’24.

Great stuff Mike! Thanks for sharing!

It's free currently on the free podcast.

A great read, (I read the summary article). Thanks for the quality content.

I liked the line "If I could live and train anywhere, it wouldn't be Eugene. If I could live and train anywhere, it would be Park City. So I live and train in Park City."

Or salt Lake, can't remember.

I know everyone is making a bid deal of the Bowerman Exodus but for almost a decade if you were a good American, you basically went to the army group or Jerry.

I think it is great to see more groups, athletes going out on their own. There can be more than one coach for the United States. Also as athletes get older it is totally normal to do more of what they want to

Thanks for chiming in coach, great insight. Do have a couple questions if you have the chance and are open to sharing!

1. Is Grant going to incorporate cross-training at all this season as an aerobic settlement considering his success with it while injured?

2. Was there any consideration of a foreign road 10K to chase the standard (eg Valencia this Sunday) considering some of the possible advantages in pacemaking/timing -allowing for World XC/competition?

A few of additional comments if you don't mind responding:

1. What would a typical weekly structure look like a few weeks away from racing i.e. is it a Tuesday and Friday workout day and Sunday harder long run or do you rotate days with more or less rest between. What do the other days look like?

2. Given the success Grant indicated in the long 10 mile tempos, will you still incorporate this throughout a training block or are they dropped for replacements like 5 mile tempo in morning and broken tempo work in the afternoon. In this context i am referring to a tempo as threshold which i assume is either marathon or half marathon paced efforts supported by lactate testing.

3. What are your thoughts on straight tempo running such as 4, 6, 8 or 10 mile tempo intervals, in comparison to broken up tempo running like 5 x 5 minutes of 3-5 x 2 miles with some recovery inbetween.

4. Do you incorporate steady running in a weekly training plan, in addition to workouts and recovery easy running.

I'm sort of curious about why Grant would pick Park City over Flagstaff when you can be in Flagstaff year round but have to leave Park City to go to Flagstaff in the winter. His coach is also closer to Flagstaff.

I think flying a coach from Phoenix to Park City multiple times a week to watch one runner work out is excessive and an unnecessary burden on the environment. It is unfortunate that this seems to be the norm in our sport. Professional running is relatively low impact compared to other professional sports and maybe this practice is something we can live with.

Saying that, I thought the interview was great.

A great listen. The read does capture what was said. It is in the verbal that so much more feeling is expressed and one can draw conclusions as to what Grant shares as important to him.

His voice is very confident in the direction he has set for himself. Given who Grant is, he undoubtedly spent a lot of time thinking about and planning this change.

Those athletes that have recently left BTC all touch on similar reasons for their departure. They are taking charge of their own destiny. it is greater risk to stay in a situation that is no longer working for you.

I have to think Jerry/Shalane and Nike didn’t think athletes in their prime would leave. Otherwise they would have addressed their concerns. If true, they underestimated these athletes. They did a big disservice to these athletes with the move to Eugene. And most likely situations before ,during, and after the move.

Having spent time in both Park City and Flagstaff, there is no comparison from a livability standpoint. They are comparable from a training standpoint but IMO Park City is better.

Grant spoke about his training location flexibility. He was in PC, now that the snow has come he is in Flag and when needed Phoenix. He knows what he is doing.

Your comment about “Burden on the environment” was a big stretch.

Great interview!

Not an easy decision to make a huge change prior to an Olympic, but GF seems to have put a good amount of thought into it. I believe the key factor is that he's happy and confident. He knows what's good for him and he's surrounding himself with people he can trust. After last season where he faced some adversity with the injury and wasn't really in a good place then came back and crushed the 3000 and 5000 showed some serious maturity. Nothing is guaranteed, but if GF stays healthy he will be on the podium in Paris.

Good Luck!

In response to your questions:

1. Is Grant going to incorporate cross-training at all this season as an aerobic settlement considering his success with it while injured? By strict definition of 'cross training,' no. We train to run so the vast majority of the training is run training. To ensure he's healthy, he does a variety of supplemental exercises to maintain balance and strength so he can run.

2. Was there any consideration of a foreign road 10K to chase the standard (eg Valencia this Sunday) considering some of the possible advantages in pacemaking/timing -allowing for World XC/competition? In a word, no. I will reiterate that Grant sets his schedule. Of course, we talk about pros and cons for certain events but he was pretty clear on the focus of the training block we're currently in. So, I'll let his response stand. In addition, there were many things in flux and many things that needed to be set up and established this Fall for training. Just that administration work took a lot of time so running earlier than mid-Feb wasn't in the plan.

Thanks!