Big Ben Top 10 All Time?

It's already clear that Mahomes is a significantly better QB than Roethlisberger ever was. Ben is harder to bring down but Mahomes is better at everything else.

SDSU Aztec wrote:

It's already clear that Mahomes is a significantly better QB than Roethlisberger ever was. Ben is harder to bring down but Mahomes is better at everything else.

No question these 4 years from Mahomes are better than Ben's best 4. You'd probably put Mahomes at 7 if he has 5 solid, maybe not as good seasons from now. If he plays near his MVP form he approaches the top 4-5. I feel like in the greatest ever convo you need minimum 6-7 great year a la Young.I think Young was maybe better than Brees/Elway but I give them the nod on longevity.

DinoZ wrote:

How about...

1.Tom Brady

2.Joe Montana

3.Peyton Manning

4.Aaron Rodgers

5.Drew Brees

7.Brett Favre

8.Dan Marino

9.Big Ben

10.Johnny U

1. TB12

2. Joe Montana

3. Aaron Rodgers

4. Drew Brees

5. John Elway

6. Peyton Manning

7. Johnny Unitas

8. Dan Marino

9. Steve Young

10. Brett Favre

juvie wrote:

Ben R. has been ... wrote:

He has been fat and out of shape for at least seven years. I can't put him ahead of Fran Tarkenton. Tarkenton played the same number of seasons but kept himself in shape. I can't put him ahead of Staubach either.

Big Ben 18 seasons 248 games (246 starts) 164 wins 81 losses 1 tie. 11 playoff appearances. 2 SB wins

Tarkenton 18 seasons 246 games (239 starts) 124wins 109 losses 6 ties 5 playoff appearances

Staubach 11 seasons 131 games 85 wins 29 losses 10 playoff appearances 2 SB wins

QBs don't play all 22 positions so they don't deserve all of the credit or blame for the team's record. Aikman played for powerhouse teams during the early to mid-'90s. During those years, they had a winning percentage for his starts of of 75%, but before and after the team's dynasty, his total win percentage was was 42%.

Just as it in not fair to compare T&F performances from cinder track days to synthetic track era, it is unfair to compare N.F.L. statistics from 1960's & 1970's to 00's & 10's. Football players on defense were allowed to hit and they did hit in 1960's & 1970's. In aggregate, Am. football players on defense were faster then so when they hit a QB, a QB felt it. Lineman then were 240-something to 270-something. Also, Am. football is like corporate America. Every football player post 1960 has had a limited impact on wins and losses. Football players prior to 1960 were more apt to play both sides of the ball and play nearly the entire game. You do not disagree that Ben R. has been fat and out of shape for at least the past (7) seven seasons.

He's arguably not even the best Steeler of all time.

He seemingly has always had decent offensive teammates around him and nearly always had a great defense behind him. He's a good solid QB for that system over many years, but not one of the true greats like some others listed in my eyes.

I was surprised Ben was even being discussed as being in the top 10, but guess it makes sense given his longevity and SB wins.

That said, despite his longevity his peak was much lower than others on the list. He made a few Pro Bowls but is only tied for 19th all-time for QB Pro Bowl selections. Heck, Philip Rivers has more Pro Bowl appearances, a better QB rating, and the same longevity. He doesn't have the SB wins but it shows what type of company Ben is in.

Shoo-in's for top 10 are (not in any particular order):

Tom Brady

Peyton Manning

Drew Brees

Aaron Rodgers

Joe Montana

Others you could maybe debate, but that should be in are:

Dan Marino

Brett Favre

Then there is more of a debate after that. Hard to see Ben above Steve Young, Johnny Unitas, etc. Personally I'd put Russell Wilson ahead of him based on Wilson's higher peak and am 1-2 seasons away from putting Mahomes ahead of him.

Regardless of who is in the top 10, Big Ben is not.

He's legendary for getting hit by a car with no helmet on and just being like "ow" when his noggin cracked the windshield.

1. Tom Brady

2. Peyton Manning

3. Joe Montana

4. Aaron Rodgers

5. Drew Brees

6. John Elway

7. Dan Marino

8. Johnny Unitas

9. Brett Favre

10. Steve Young

I would say:

1 - Tom Brady

2 - Joe Montana

3 - Otto Graham

4 - Peyton Manning

5 - Roger Staubach

6 - Dan Marino

7 - Aaron Rodgers

8 - John Elway

9 - Johnny Unitas

10 - Drew Brees

my goodness wrote:

Regardless of who is in the top 10, Big Ben is not.

He's legendary for getting hit by a car with no helmet on and just being like "ow" when his noggin cracked the windshield.

Good recall remembering the wreck. However, reports said that his face was unrecognizable and he had major surgery. It was also reported that a major artery was bleeding into his stomach and if not for an exceptional EMT, he would have bled to death before getting to the hospital.

He was a tough guy but hardly said "ow" and moved on.

Against the Ravens his nose was shoved onto the side of his face. They snapped it back, put a strip of tape on it, and back in the game he went, without missing a series. Tough, yes. But not one of the truly elite of all time.

My top 10:

1) Tom Brady

2) Peyton Manning

3) Joe Montana

4) Aaron Rodgers

5) Johnny Unitas

6) John Elway

7) Dan Marino

8) Steve Young

9) Drew Brees

10) Brett Favre

Mahomes and Russell Wilson could sneak into the top 10 in a few years.

dafdf wrote:

Elway's stats were not better than Favre's. His stats, actually, seem pretty mediocre. He had a passer rating of 79.9 for his career and threw over 2 interceptions for every touchdown he threw.

You must be using that new math.

Elway had 300 career TD passes and 226 career passes intercepted.

In the old math it is not true that 226 > 2 x 300.

I would say Favre is generally underrated on here. 3 straight MVPs 95-97. Widely considered the best QB for about 5 years from 1994-1998. You couldn't say that about Elway really at any point in his career (won 1 MVP) or Brees. Throwing 35 TDs and 12 picks in those years with the rules was akin to more like a 45/10 line nowadays.

DinoZ wrote:

How about...

1.Tom Brady

2.Joe Montana

3.Peyton Manning

4.Aaron Rodgers

5.Drew Brees

7.Brett Favre

8.Dan Marino

9.Big Ben

10.Johnny U

A good age test is if you think 6 of the 9 best QBs of all time played in the last 20 years.

Also, if your top 10 list only has 9 names on it.

THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:

I would say Favre is generally underrated on here. 3 straight MVPs 95-97. Widely considered the best QB for about 5 years from 1994-1998. You couldn't say that about Elway really at any point in his career (won 1 MVP) or Brees. Throwing 35 TDs and 12 picks in those years with the rules was akin to more like a 45/10 line nowadays.

You make some good statistical points, but as a fan of another team I never feared Farve. That was because he could rack up incredible stats in a game........ or be the worst player on the field.

With Elway, you ALWAYS feared that match-up as a fan.

Q score wrote:

Dan Marino is better than Drew Brees. I don't care that Brees won a Superbowl or has more career yards (benefitted from his era). Dan Marino put up 2022 type numbers in the 1980's when nobody else was doing that. His release was so good that he could overcome a lot of weakness on his offensive line. Despite not having won a Superbowl, he was clutch and carried his teams to a lot of wins.

No...he's not better than Brees. Drew is a SB MVP and has several NFC championship appearances. Marino is not a SB winning QB and only took the team to the playoffs in 10 of his 17 seasons- hardly impressive.

The SB is ultimate achievement and how well the QB keeps the team in SB contention each year means more than anything else. "You play to win the SB." Look how crappy the Saints are without Brees - he was the impetus of that team's success! 🏈

It's a very good question - initial gut feeling was no but very close.

Brady, Montana, Elway, Manning are the Rushmore, I think it's tough to make a case against that. So that is 6 spots left containing names such as (in no order) Brees, Marino, Unitas, Staubach, Rodgers, Young, Bradshaw (the Bill Russell factor - he still did win 4 rings), Graham, Bart Starr, Favre and Roethlisberger.

I think it then really depends on your criteria for greatness. Here are the selling points for Ben.

2 rings (still more than Rodgers, Brees, Favre) and played in one more. Truly a man of steel - 19 years and NEVER had a losing record in a season with only a handful of missed games. Led league in passing multiple times and has secretly amassed awesome numbers - 5th in wins, 5th in yards, 5th in playoff yards, 8th in passing TD's. On field could absorb a crazy amount of hit's and maybe was the best QB in history for staying on his feet and extending plays - something rarely talked about.

So honestly, despite that gut feeling I think he is right there at the cusp, I wouldn't be aggrieved if he was anywhere from 9-12 to be honest and the numbers and memories of him would support that. I will also say this, of all the QB's in the modern era there is only one other QB I would want more with the ball in the final 2min needing a game winning drive in a playoff game and that's Brady. I would take BR over Brees, Rodgers, Manning - all of them except TB12

BTW, if you want to find an actual modern-day comparable for Big Ben, it's not Brett Favre, it's...

Eli Manning.