Frank Shorter vs. Jim Ryun. Who ya got?

I actually didn't know that Ryun broke the WR by such big margins. That's a great fact for this poll. I'm not sure who I'm voting for yet honestly. I'm tempted by Shorter, but I have to research the subject more before placing a vote.

I always wonder why Ryun didn't have a longer career, other than that was very abnormal back then before pro running was a big thing.

I think a 2 mile race would have settled it. Not sure who would win.

Neither ran modern times, so I do not care much about by how much they beat other records in their eras.

Each cheated out of an Olympic Gold by some b.s. Shorter still won one.

Shorter also won other major races.

Ryun probably showed more talent and wowed everyone in HS. He also ended his career not too long after.

Watch a couple of YouTube videos of Ryun's races. No one ever looked as good running a mile until Morceli and El G came along and they may have had pharmacological assistance, and no one has looked as good since although a few have run faster times.

Those of you who Ryun would have won gold at sea level in 1968 most have not noticed who fast Keino ran in that 1500 and how much he won by. As to why Ryun didn't have a long career, he'd been world class since age 17 and being in two Olympic Games in those days was very exceptional. Plus, naive as it seems in retrospective, people really did have high hopes for that new pro track tour in 1974 and 1975. Ryun needed to make money and was probably getting a lot of pressure from his peers to join up.

Ryun. Hands down.

Ryun is the ONLY high school runner to ever beat a reigning olympic champion. When Ryun ran his HS mile record of 3:55.3 he defeated Peter Snell by out kicking him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_E-R97LShwA

Shorter for the win - none of us or even this board or the huge running movement including the females on the other side would not be here without Frank's win in Munich. He lit the fuse.

218er wrote:

Shorter for the win ... He lit the fuse.

Nope. Ryun did that. After he ran sub 4 for the mile in HS he was followed by two other HS runners who also broke 4 minutes (Liquori and Danielson). After HS Ryun set the mile WR in 1966 when he was 19 years old, breaking the old record by 2.5 seconds.

Ryun. Not even close.

Shorter should never have even reached the men’s final, and it’s because his times are so unremarkable. They matter in this sport.

Rojo for the win ..... period.

Shorter by a country mile.

Not only did he have, IMHO, the better running career, but he had a much greater impact in the running scene by helping end the amateur nonsense and by helping grow running through his performances in Munich and Montreal.

did ya know wrote:

Ryun. Hands down.

Ryun is the ONLY high school runner to ever beat a reigning olympic champion. When Ryun ran his HS mile record of 3:55.3 he defeated Peter Snell by out kicking him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_E-R97LShwA

Only American, but Jakob beat Centro a couple of years ago at a younger age.

It was an astonishing achievement by Ryun, but Snell was basically semi-retired at that point.

jamesbuffet wrote:

Lame Fake Name wrote:

Those of you who Ryun would have won gold at sea level in 19968 most have not noticed who fast Keino ran in that 1500 and how much he won by.

Keino's win is a more obvious doping case than the East German who beat Shorter in Montréal.

+1

Coevett wrote:

did ya know wrote:

Ryun. Hands down.

Ryun is the ONLY high school runner to ever beat a reigning olympic champion. When Ryun ran his HS mile record of 3:55.3 he defeated Peter Snell by out kicking him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_E-R97LShwA

Only American, but Jakob beat Centro a couple of years ago at a younger age.

It was an astonishing achievement by Ryun, but Snell was basically semi-retired at that point.

Snell ran within a ~3 seconds of the then WR and lost to Ryun.

Oh, so the first time he has somebody to push him, he runs slower than his PB.

Snell lost several times that year. He was going through the motions. He was close to invincible the year before.

Ryun would still be a medal threat today imo. Give him one year of modern training with modern equipment and he would be running 3:28 in Monaco. I do not feel the same way about Shorter. I tend to think he would not break 27. I do think he would run 2:06 or so in Vaporflys though.

Ryun's win over Lagat was just. But Shorter robbed Rupp thanks to the brojos. Ryun>Lagat>Shorter. Shorter should be in 4th place, not contending for the win.

Ryun over Shorter at any distance up to and including two miles.

Shorter over Ryun at six miles and up.

Three miles and 5k -- unknown.

Sports Illustrated covers is a good way to judge how important a runner to the general public.

Jim Ryun 7

Frank Shorter 3

https://sicovers.com/art/ryun

https://sicovers.com/art/frank+shorter

It's a tough call, because if we're talking pure "distance runner", Ryun is kinda borderline to fit that category. He's not done much of anything in the true distance events. That being said, with mid-d considered with equal weight to distance, as this contest seems to be implying. I've got to go with Ryun. Full disclosure, I developed a personal friendship with Jim over the years, so that may bias my opinion.