So the Tokyo marathon is stealing people money ?

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  • Abeneziel
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 1:56pm CST
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    They are cancelling the Marathon for non elite people.

    - They are not refunding anybody
    - People who have been cancelled can run next year but will have to repay

    WTF ? Who would accept being robbed like that? I think I must start my own marathon scheme to steal people's money.

    And worse, it is cancelled because of the coronavirus, which is in China, a country which has no land border with Japan. Japan has no morre risk than Australia, the USA or Europe.

    Are they really getting away with such a steal? That's high level robbery in a big spotlight and without any shame.
  • chargebackbabby
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 1:59pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    If everyone issued a chargeback through their bank, that would be a bit of a headache for Tokyo - even if you might not win.
  • Co-Flounder
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 2:16pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    The Tokyo Marathon needs to keep those fees to pay for the Elite race.

    Without hobby joggers there would not be separate elite fields in major marathons. The elites need free race entry, free travel and free room and board. Those goodies gotta be paid for from somebody’s pockets.

    We can’t risk the elite athletes coming into contact with the unwashed masses ad getting sick.

    Canceling the race is wrong. Keeping people’s money after canceling a race for any reason is wrong and should be illegal.
  • pierre_paris_206
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 2:31pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    Will race shirts and medals be distributed?
  • 800 dude
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 2:45pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    Abeneziel wrote:
    WTF ? Who would accept being robbed like that?


    People who can read a contract. If you tried to get your money back, you'd be the one "robbing" the Tokyo Marathon because your contract clearly allocated the risks between the parties.
  • Raddison
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 2:48pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    It's in the Entry Regulations (Item 13):

    Entry-fee will be refunded only for case of event cancellation due to snow, flood, structural damage due to strong wind, lightning, tornado, building fire along the course, cancellation order from the authorities concerned, cancellation due to earthquake within Japan, and in case of J-ALERT announcement (war/terrorist). Note, cancellation due to the reason not listed above and not accountable to the Organizer will not be refunded.
  • Tools And Corpses
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 2:50pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    China is ranked first in Japan for travel and tourism's contribution, even for the Tokyo marathon
  • Facts are worthless
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 3:13pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    Completely pathetic and total theft. They could at least refund a portion of the money (the amount they didn't spend on medals, shirts, permits, etc). Or they could let people in next year for mostly free. But if they are doing neither of those then this is theft. I agree I would dispute with the credit card company, they organizers can't really do anything about that.
  • tired of theft
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 3:16pm CST
    re: 800 dude
    Forum Index
    Since the marathon organizer has cancelled the race, the contract has been cancelled. The entrant has received no consideration for his/her entry fee.
  • 800 dude
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 3:36pm CST
    re: tired of theft
    Forum Index
    tired of theft wrote:
    Since the marathon organizer has cancelled the race, the contract has been cancelled. The entrant has received no consideration for his/her entry fee.


    You'll pass the bar one of these days.
  • not my real name
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 3:39pm CST
    re: 800 dude
    Forum Index
    800 dude, sometimes I miss the hell outta you, your wit proceeds you.
  • 800 dude
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 3:44pm CST
    re: not my real name
    Forum Index
    not my real name wrote:
    800 dude, sometimes I miss the hell outta you, your wit proceeds you.


    Ha. Likewise!
  • Abeneziel
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 3:52pm CST
    re: 800 dude
    Forum Index
    I think that I will always be amazed by the corporate shills who bring up "contracts" each time. They don't know that a contract is worth nothing if it is against the law and the regulations. You can write anything in a contract, but any stipulation which is found against the law is void, completely nullified and abrogated on the spot without any effect of prejudice.

    Courts routinely destroy abusive contracts who do not respect the law. You can try to deny any liability or deny any refund by contract, but the law is there and can be enforced.
  • Abeneziel
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 3:54pm CST
    re: Raddison
    Forum Index
    Raddison wrote:
    It's in the Entry Regulations (Item 13):

    Entry-fee will be refunded only for case of event cancellation due to snow, flood, structural damage due to strong wind, lightning, tornado, building fire along the course, cancellation order from the authorities concerned, cancellation due to earthquake within Japan, and in case of J-ALERT announcement (war/terrorist). Note, cancellation due to the reason not listed above and not accountable to the Organizer will not be refunded.


    It is absolutely accountable to the Organizer. They are the only one cancelling marathons outside of China. Is the London Marathon cancelled? Nope.

    That's just robbery.
  • Hardloper
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 3:58pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    If a marathon was cancelled and I didn't get a refund I wouldn't really care. Even if you get your entry fee refunded, you're never going to be reimbursed for flights, hotels, or the cost of finding another race. The entry fee is a small cost overall and when you sign up for an event you have to accept some risk that it could be cancelled.
  • 800 dude
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 4:02pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    Abeneziel wrote:
    I think that I will always be amazed by the corporate shills who bring up "contracts" each time. They don't know that a contract is worth nothing if it is against the law and the regulations. You can write anything in a contract, but any stipulation which is found against the law is void, completely nullified and abrogated on the spot without any effect of prejudice.

    Courts routinely destroy abusive contracts who do not respect the law. You can try to deny any liability or deny any refund by contract, but the law is there and can be enforced.


    I think that I will always be amazed by people who are certain that anything that they feel is unfair is illegal. What "law and regulations" does this contract violate?

    Courts in the United States occasionally (not routinely) refuse to enforce "unconscionable" contracts, but that's an extremely high bar. No court would ever say that it's unconscionable to allocate the risk of cancellation of a road race to the entrant.
  • Abeneziel
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 4:03pm CST
    re: Hardloper
    Forum Index
    Hardloper wrote:
    If a marathon was cancelled and I didn't get a refund I wouldn't really care. Even if you get your entry fee refunded, you're never going to be reimbursed for flights, hotels, or the cost of finding another race. The entry fee is a small cost overall and when you sign up for an event you have to accept some risk that it could be cancelled.


    Hotels can be cancelled. But this is another matter. The organisers decide they cancel the race for amateurs and decide they can keep the money. This is wrong on all levels and can't be justified.
  • Abeneziel
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 4:06pm CST
    re: 800 dude
    Forum Index
    That's a low bar everywhere in the world. Law takes precedence over any contract.

    Try to sell any product. If it immediately breaks down, explode, never start, or is not delivered, you can write in any contract that it will not be refunded, the law will make sure you will be refunded.
  • Co-Flounder
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 4:09pm CST
    re: Hardloper
    Forum Index
    Not true. It depends on the situation. Many places that don’t offer refunds are often sympathetic to circumstances that are beyond control. A phone call is often all that’s needed to get a refund along with patience, a reasonable explanation of the circumstances, and kind words.

    It’s best to contact the hotel and airlines as soon as the race is cancelled.
  • 800 dude
    registered
    3 months ago 02/18/2020 4:28pm CST
    re: Abeneziel
    Forum Index
    Abeneziel wrote:
    That's a low bar everywhere in the world. Law takes precedence over any contract.

    Try to sell any product. If it immediately breaks down, explode, never start, or is not delivered, you can write in any contract that it will not be refunded, the law will make sure you will be refunded.


    This was really informative. Thanks for educating me. I'm going to get back to working on a Supreme Court brief now. If I have any further questions about "the law," mind if I pop in and ask you? You seem very knowledgeable.