for the sake of simple #’s. let’s assume i’m running 50 mi/week. my target marathon pace is 6:50min/mi. how many/what % of those 50 weekly miles should i run at 6:50min/mi or faster?
source of info to increase your credibility appreciated. if you’re Eliud Kipchoge, you can just cite yourself. thanks!!
20%. 10 miles per week over 2 workouts sounds about right. It's a rule of thumb that everyone refers to and works well for a lot of people. 60 mpw/12 miles at MP or faster would be better.
I've never done huge mileage (occasionally up to 80 mpw) but, in my opinion, as you decrease your mileage you can increase the % of faster miles. I'm only running about 50 mpw at the moment but my tempo runs and intervals as still the same length as when I'm running further.
20% is probably about where I am at the moment but it will be much more if I do a long MP run.
You would probably benefit more by upping your overall mileage from 50 than you would by running any more at your goal MP or faster. I'm guessing that you've run a 10k or half that indicates you're in 2:58ish shape, so you want to go for it. Chances are your mileage will prove to be way low for the marathon.
At what point of the build?
Source of credibility: Normal load progression and periodization?
What you do when is important. So running 20% of your volume at MP always isn't the best idea. Sometimes it is perfect. But if you do that year round and I am willing to bet your MP doesn't move much (assuming all else equal).
my 2c wrote:
20%. 10 miles per week over 2 workouts sounds about right. It's a rule of thumb that everyone refers to and works well for a lot of people. 60 mpw/12 miles at MP or faster would be better.
Eh, I do a lot more than this. I guess to each their own.
Normal week is 60MPW, and at peak, I would do something like 5-10 miles at marathon pace or faster during a tempo run, a 20 mile long run with 10ish at marathon pace, and then some assorted speedwork that might be like 3-6 miles of intervals at 10K/HM pace. So I am probably more like 40% at marathon pace or faster. Sometimes I will end my easy runs with one mile or half mile at marathon pace. Good to throw them in when you're really relaxed to work on economy IMO.
I don't think the marathon pace miles kill you. Marathon pace is pretty "slow." I think it's the faster-than-marathon pace work that adds up quickly. I probably limit my work faster than MPW to about 10% or less.
Shane33 wrote:
At what point of the build?
Source of credibility: Normal load progression and periodization?
What you do when is important. So running 20% of your volume at MP always isn't the best idea. Sometimes it is perfect. But if you do that year round and I am willing to bet your MP doesn't move much (assuming all else equal).
This ^. At the moment I don't do too much at marathon pace but I'm also in week 3 of my buildup. I ran 69.5 miles last week and from what I've only run at marathon pace or faster for 6 miles of the week. This was my past week:
M: Off
T: 11.02 miles, 7:05 pace. 6x 30 sec on/30 sec easy
W: 10.37 miles, 6:37 pace. 3 miles easy, 5x 2' on (Paces: 5:16, 5:14, 5:10, 5:06, 5:09), 5 x 30" on (Paces: 4:15, 4:46, 4:46, 4:39, 4:39), 3 easy.
TH: AM: 4 miles, 7:40 pace, PM: 10 miles, 7:15 pace
F: 7.01 miles, 7:23 pace
S: 15 miles, 6:29 pace. 6 miles easy, 3x 1 mile @marathon pace (5:35, 5:31, 5:32) with 1 mile float in between (6:31, 6:24, 6:30), 3 x 1 min on (4:56,4:50, 5:14[uphill]), 2 min easy, finish at 15.
Sunday: 12 miles, 6:53 pace.
3 weeks out from my goal marathon last fall:
September 30th
M: Off
T: 8 miles easy, 6x30" on, 1 min off. 9.41 miles, 7:06 pace
W: Easy 8 miles, 7:13 pace
TH: Workout, 3 miles easy, 5x 2' on 1' off, 6x 30" on 1' off), (Paces for first part: 5:10, 6:45, 5:08, 6:46, 5:05, 6:44, 5:04, 6:54, 5:07) (Paces for second part: 4:35, 6:41, 4:29, 7:11, 4:37, 7:16, 4:33, 7:13, 4:32, 7:21, 4:26, 7:33) Had to dodge people on a really tight park loop
F: Easy 6.13: 7:41 pace
S: 10 miles plus 30" on 1' off. 11.56 miles, 6:56 pace
Sun: Long Run/Workout: 10K easy, 8 x 1 mile on, 1 mile cruise (+1 minute), 2.32 miles easy home. 16.32 miles, 6:35 pace (Paces: 5:31, 6:31, 5:29, 6:28, 5:29, 6:26, 5:26, 6:18)
I ran 2:30:25 last fall and am shooting for 2:20 mid at Boston. Exact marathon pace? I don't hit it too often or for long stretches of time but I'm also hitting faster turnover stuff regularly. I'm also fairly injury prone so we try to limit the amount of sustained efforts so that I maintain a higher mileage. To each their own I guess. This has worked out for me pretty well.
For the marathon at your point more mileage is better than trying to run workouts. You need to be able to run a half marathon without even trying. At 50 mpw a half marathon probably still feels long, a marathon would feel crazy long and there's not much 'speed' that will happen