Engels: almost quit running because of NC State

I think there’s some truth to the point that going hard or whatever everyday doesn’t work, but NC State has also produced some really good talents in recent years like Ryan Hill and Andrew Colley. So yea, one size does not fit all.

I would bet part of it was that Craing was like 5 star recruit so to speak. Didn’t he run like 4:03 in HS? I bet because he didn’t succeed early he was like ‘well I need to go somewhere else because i’m A boss’. Maybe he would have turned the corner if he stuck around at NC State.

But then again it seems like Ole Miss is a mid d and mile powerhouse. So probably a good call. Maybe the NC State system is better for long distance runners.

Not totally related, but I think ‘not being able to handle the training’ really comes down to the attrition of being an elite collegiate athlete: they. Can’t all become stars.

Junior HS runner here. I know many rising seniors who are considering staying in state are opting to not consider NC state as this has been a common thread lately. It’s hard to even get on the team in the first place and once you’re their they don’t really put time into your development. True they have some studs and put more energy into their success, but so many good runners from NC have not improved there. I think more of the above average guys who aren’t the best in the state but pretty high up there are starting to consider the smaller D1 schools in NC that have some great coaching. I’m not running in college so no dog in the fight for me.

Engels is one of like half a dozen high school boys to run sub-1:50 for 800 and sub-9:00 for 3200. He had some success at NC State. He ran 3:45 as a RS freshman.

Providence Day: I feel like I could say the same about my home states major state school, they can grab the states best home grown talents but they’re not guaranteed to succeed. Same situation where the training is questionable, except they don’t run ENOUGH mileage instead of too much/ going too hard every day. And as you said, if they are above average but not the best, it’s kind of a toss up as to how much you improve as a collegian.

Also forgot , shout-out to Sam/George Parsons.

I just read the actual article now. Engels threw his original coach under the bus and didn’t appreciate that year of training. All training you do contributes to your success, not just the kind that’s more recent to your success. It didn’t break him, did it? So what’s the big deal? As someone else posted, 3:45 as a frosh is a great start. Some guys don’t break out right away. Why can’t he just say that it wasn’t the best training for him but he still learned some things and he moved on? All’s well that ends well bro. And then he throws in the fact that his HS girlfriend broke up with him, wahh wah waaahhh, that happens all the time.

Disclaimer if you couldn’t tell; i’m Not a huge fan of Engels whole shtick and personality.

NC State does get an unbelievable amount of talent and their #1 runner now will be a 4th year transfer from Dayton. Don’t believe they qualified anyone to NCAA Track Championships in a while?

I always find it comical when people make blanket statements like this about someone they've never met, let alone spent any time with.

Clueless Joe , yea who knows maybe he’s chill but i’m Never gonna meet the guy. It’s just part of being a sports fan dawg.

Engels ran 4:03.96 in the full mile in high school. That is equivalent to 3:45 in the 1500.

NC State ruins more talent than just about every other school in the nation.

They had Shanklin qualify for NCAA's in the 5k as a true sophomore. Craig also isn't telling the complete truth about why he left NC State

This is very true! The coaches there are sitting on their high horse and not trying to develop anyone. Lots of transfers and injures!

Um he almost quit running. And no, not all training contributes to your success, going into a meat grinder, getting injured etc. doesn’t contribute to success. The coach clearly knows what type of program he is running, no foul in pointing it out what goes on there.

It doesn't matter if he ran 3:59 in high school. 3:45 as a frosh is a very good frosh year. Most frosh don't make that good of a transition as their high school GF is dumping them, they're eating pizza in the dorms every night at midnight, partying half as much as the average college frosh but still twice as much as the average elite athlete should, etc etc. Point is, anyone who runs 3:45 as a freshman did a lot right...and shows just how much talent Craig has. So it wasn't the right fit for him...that's fine. But it's highly likely he's not taking responsibility for some of his own actions in his time there as another poster alluded to. Fortunately Rolly Geiger doesn't give two sh!ts because he doesn't have to. If you want to go to a school where the coaches have to kow tow to the athletes, don't stay in the south.

Engels forgot to mention that he was a problem for both the team and the coach that gave him an opportunity. He needs to own his stuff rather than rag on NC State.

Can someone spell it out for me and anyone else what you mean by ‘not developing’ runners?

Engels is allowed to feel however he wants about the culture of NC State, but the guy was caught multiple times skipping practice while he was there. One time he was even caught shopping for groceries while the team was out on an easy run, so to imply that his lack of success or performance was due to the coaches and culture is a load of poo. He barely put in the effort in Raleigh, so regardless of your feelings on the program, Engels lack of success or impact are on his shoulders and his alone. His exit from the program was also a lot more complicated than him just up and deciding to leave.

Juice Springsteen wrote:

Can someone spell it out for me and anyone else what you mean by ‘not developing’ runners?

I’m not even a coach and know what this means mr juicy juice.

If they are getting some of the top distance kids in NC, which has fairly decent talent. Why aren’t they getting anyone to the NCAA first round? While UNCC and Furman are getting multiple athlete who had similar if not slower HS PRs? Mid majors getting it done while NC State is grinding the meat..

ODJ, that’s great but entertain me here.

So what’s this elusive meat grinder? Like 70 MPW with a lot of hard tempos and ...idk, what else?

This reminds of some Mick Byrne quote that goes something g like “you can’t handle 70 MPW? Well then I guess you can’t run”.

Insiders, How crazy can Geiger’s training be?

I would argue that if a coach gave athletes a cautious amount of difficulty in training, they’d actually be doing them a disservice. Athletes wouldn’t be given the opportunity to maximize their potential. You gotta risk it for the biscuit.

Juice Springsteen wrote:

ODJ, that’s great but entertain me here.

So what’s this elusive meat grinder? Like 70 MPW with a lot of hard tempos and ...idk, what else?

This reminds of some Mick Byrne quote that goes something g like “you can’t handle 70 MPW? Well then I guess you can’t run”.

Insiders, How crazy can Geiger’s training be?

I would argue that if a coach gave athletes a cautious amount of difficulty in training, they’d actually be doing them a disservice. Athletes wouldn’t be given the opportunity to maximize their potential. You gotta risk it for the biscuit.

High mileage, don’t promote recovery just run hard everyday. Easily over 90 mpw, run 7 days a week, 4 Doubles, 2 hr long run. Nothing individualized to that athletes high school progression. So it works for the high mileage Hs runners but the 30 mpw guys break. You can train athletes to perform at their best using many different ways But they have ONE plan and it’s suppose to be a one size fits all but as any great coach should know, running doesn’t work like that. JS you don’t seem very experienced in this area so better to stop while you’re ahead