Seeking training advice to reach sub 50min 10km.

Double your weekly mileage ( gradually of course) ; run 6 days a week

I’m a 53 yo hobby jogger who just ran 48:12 recently- averaging 40 mpw with one quality session ( tempo, intervals, hill repeats) and a long run up to 16 on occasion. All runs slow as molasses except for the quality day- 10-11 min miles. Sometimes make the LR a progression down to 10 k pace by end

53 years and running 48min 10k wow! That is very impressive.

So my goal should be to increase the mileage and I should get better?

Do you think I should swap out my gymdays for easy runningdays instead?

Oh I forgot to mention I am 25y old if that makes any difference.

How old are you? For beginners, just do the following:

Gradually build up to running a hour per day. Run by feel, throw away the watch. Some days you'll feel good and hammer it. Other days you'll run slower than a tortoise.

Every 2-3 days do some strides.

And whenever you feel good throw in some surges, that is fartlek.

I noticed I missed my age but can't find an edit option! Sorry about that.

I am 25 years old.

Appreciate the tips!

By building up to an hour a day do you mean like 7 days a week? I admit that I am addicted to looking at my watch all the time but maybe thats a bad idea.

I always run after speed and not time, you think I should vary that?

Usually saturday on my longrun I run more by feel like you said instead of looking at my pace, this is why longrun pace differs alot. Fartlek is something I am trying to put into my Longruns but i'm not sure how to do them properly yet.

Short Answer: Not only do you need to run more miles, you need to run faster.

Long Answer: Your easy pace is too slow compared to your recovery pace. Try going out at 6:35 m/k for your easy run and 7 flat for your recovery. If you're already at the gym, get on the treadmill for an easy(ish) 5-8km. After your easy run and long run, do some 100m strides; start off with 4x100m. Don't run them all out, but run them faster than your tempo pace.

You will get faster, you just got to work.

my stats:

late 30s male, 8 years solid running, but ran on & off from grade school through college). 17:45 5k; 39:39 10k; 1:12:21 10mi; (i haven't run an official half or a full marathon in three years, all times are from 2018).

Vintasia wrote:

I noticed I missed my age but can't find an edit option! Sorry about that.

I am 25 years old.

Appreciate the tips!

By building up to an hour a day do you mean like 7 days a week? I admit that I am addicted to looking at my watch all the time but maybe thats a bad idea.

I always run after speed and not time, you think I should vary that?

Usually saturday on my longrun I run more by feel like you said instead of looking at my pace, this is why longrun pace differs alot. Fartlek is something I am trying to put into my Longruns but i'm not sure how to do them properly yet.

Fartlek is easy, speed play. Run and throw in some surges. As Bruce Lee said, "Don't think, feel".

Yes, I mean running a hour a day, which means 7 days a week. You don't have to run every day, but most days. I know life and what not gets in the way. But the idea is to spend time on your feet 9 out of 10 days.

Should you switch up the speed of your runs? Yes. Some days are going be easy and slow. And others are going be harder. Arthur Lydiard used effort based feel:

1/4 effort

1/2 effort

3/4 effort

Most days are going be between 1/4 and 1/2 effort with one or two runs a week at 3/4 effort. Also, you can do something called a progression run. Start off at 1/4 effort and slowly pick up the pace and finish at 3/4 effort. Just go by feel. Get in tuned with your body. Re-read the Bruce Lee quote as far as feel.

I love this advice!

6:35 min/km on easydays are very doable for me. Will try to run harder on those days, do you think longruns should be only easy pace or put in some speed in it?

I have a very hard time understanding what speeds I should do at it.

My temporuns are at 5:50 because my garmin says threshold is at 5:53min/km pace...I have no idea if I should stick to it or make it faster.

I will try to change my plan and run at the gym before or after the strenght training and see how it goes.

Your stats are off the charts impressive.

Do you workout your legs and abs to reach such speeds, or did you only run for those 8 years?

Thank you for taking the time to respond sir.

Your running aproach is very interesting.

Running 9/10 days is doable for me since it's my nr1 hobby and I love every second of it.

Running more and mixing it up I will take it to heart.

What are your thoughts about strenght exercises at the gym.

Should I drop them or are they beneficial?

Vintasia wrote:

What are your thoughts about strenght exercises at the gym.

Should I drop them or are they beneficial?

Hills are number one when it comes to building strength for runners. If you live in a area with little to no hills, yes definitely do some deadlifts and squats. If you do have hills where you live, do it occasionally if you want.

thank you

There is an old saying that long slow runs make long slow runners. That being said, your long runs should be at steady-state (a pace you can hold for X amount of miles). This should be faster than easy-pace but slower than tempo. Pacing takes work; I still struggle with it.

GPS watches & Phone Apps are great tools for training but shouldn't be relied on as coaches. Think of them as training partners. You want to focus on feel since you're relatively new to the sport. By all means, use the watch to track distance, time, etc, but focus on your vitals (breathing & heartrate). If it feels like you're going too hard, you probably are. If you feel like you can sing a song, you should definitely speed up.

You stated in a different comment running is #1. Running should be first. You don't want to be too tired/spent from HIIT to get your run in.

Thank you for saying this. There are plenty of people much faster than me though (probably most of LRC, lol).

I don't do a whole lot of supplemental training, other than some lifting & core work at home. Lots of stretching with long holds. I cross-train on my bike from late Spring through mid-Autumn. Swim & hike in the summer too. I found squats & lunges helped increase my leg power which bettered my ability to run up hills (which really are "speedwork is disguise."

You're quite welcome. If I may make a book suggestion, pick up a copy of Pete Pfitzinger's Faster Road Racing 5k - Half Marathon. It came out in 2015. This is one of the books I wish would have existed when I started out. Best of luck to you.

My plan now will be:

1. Increase weekly mileage slowly.

2. Increase the speed on my easypace to 6:30-6:40min/km.

3. Swap one of my gym days to a run day, will now be 5 days of running each week.

4. The days spent at gym will be started with running as warmup.

5. Longrun pace will be increased to a pace faster than easy but slower than tempo.

Hopefully I can reach sub 50min 10k with this before 2020 :)

I read your post several times and took everything to heart, truly!

Learned alot today and you were a big part of it, I will make sure to pick up a copy of Pete Pfitzinger's too!

Thanks.

You will experience pain in a 10k race. You need to experience pain in training. Add some intervals. Say mile or 2 mile repeats. 6x1 mile and/or 3x mile. The key is short recovery. 1000m repeats with short recovery works, too.

Is longer intervalls better for 10k training?

Lets say 3x 1km 5k race pace or maybe longer intervalls.

Or

Something like 8x 200m intervalls?

Distance that between 3-4mins. 1km is too hard for you atm. You are looking for improvement,not pain.