Jakob Ingebrigtsen Training

Exactly. He trains at 2.5-3.5 mmol (lactate) pace, which for him is around 1 hour (3.5) to 2 hours (2.5) pace.

Every given day, his pace at 3.5 mmol is different, depending on fuel status, how he feels, how recovered/fatigued he is etc.

I wish lactate testing was more prominent in the US high school/D1 scene, as it's super beneficial to train at the optimal paces.

LateRunnerPhil wrote:

Exactly. He trains at 2.5-3.5 mmol (lactate) pace, which for him is around 1 hour (3.5) to 2 hours (2.5) pace.

Every given day, his pace at 3.5 mmol is different, depending on fuel status, how he feels, how recovered/fatigued he is etc.

I wish lactate testing was more prominent in the US high school/D1 scene, as it's super beneficial to train at the optimal paces.

laterunnerphil, so, his training is based mostly on keeping his runs at a threshold effort, taking into account all the variables of the day? So, not a lot of fast stuff or slow, easy running?

tellmemore wrote:

LateRunnerPhil wrote:

Exactly. He trains at 2.5-3.5 mmol (lactate) pace, which for him is around 1 hour (3.5) to 2 hours (2.5) pace.

Every given day, his pace at 3.5 mmol is different, depending on fuel status, how he feels, how recovered/fatigued he is etc.

I wish lactate testing was more prominent in the US high school/D1 scene, as it's super beneficial to train at the optimal paces.

laterunnerphil, so, his training is based mostly on keeping his runs at a threshold effort, taking into account all the variables of the day? So, not a lot of fast stuff or slow, easy running?

In general yes. In the base phase for example, he only had one session where he produces higher lactate values (2x10x200 at hills).

In competition phase, he definitely has harder sessions too, one staple is 10x300 in ~39s.

Should you copy his training? Probably not, he does 3 hard sessions in base phase, then 4-5 hard sessions in transition phase (often twice a day, with the morning being the easier of the two workouts), before going back to 3 hard sessions in competition phase.

You know alot about his training, you have been a massive help as I have been studying many documents of his training and I am soon starting threshold based training.

Could you tell me does threshold training also benefit 800m speed because when Jakob was 14 he was capable of running sub 2:00. If the threshold training accompanied with some hills isn't the reason for this then, what speed sessions complemented this.

You don't need speed sessions when you can already run fast enough for the required pace. Especially when you are a kid.

runnerrunner100 wrote:

You know alot about his training, you have been a massive help as I have been studying many documents of his training and I am soon starting threshold based training.

Could you tell me does threshold training also benefit 800m speed because when Jakob was 14 he was capable of running sub 2:00. If the threshold training accompanied with some hills isn't the reason for this then, what speed sessions complemented this.

You just answered your own question. The threshold and speed is the exact reason for it. The 800m is a little more dominant aerobically than what was once though. Plus, Gert (father/coach) has said that the muscle fiber composition of all of his sons has them better suited towards aerobic work. That is why all the brother do longer distance events as their off events more then the 800m. Henrik is moving to the 5k and Jakob has done steeple/5k in the past. Filip has had decent success at the 3k distance.

If you are the way they are, then training as a 1500/5k guy is more beneficial. You don’t have to be in super great shape to go 1:47 or something if you are like them. I know that may be unfathomable to you, but you have to warp your expectations a bit. Do you think 2:00 for an 800m is unreasonable for, let’s say, a 4:05 1500m guy? Now what about a 3:31 1500m guy? You don’t “require” a super fast 800m to be able to do that. You just go to crank 56s for 3.75 laps. They just approach their training from one side more than others.

Thanks alot, you have been a big help. Does anyone know anything about their strength and conditioning sessions?

"Now what about a 3:31 1500m guy? You don’t “require” a super fast 800m to be able to do that. You just go to crank 56s for 3.75 laps. They just approach their training from one side more than others."

But in order to win championship races you do need to be able to accelerate and sprint. This is Jacob's weakness at the moment, witness the recent European Indoor 1500. Unless he improves his 800 pb he will be vulnerable in World or Olympic finals unless he can get someone to set a reasonably fast pace (one of his brothers??) as El G did in his prime.

milermb wrote:

"Now what about a 3:31 1500m guy? You don’t “require” a super fast 800m to be able to do that. You just go to crank 56s for 3.75 laps. They just approach their training from one side more than others."

But in order to win championship races you do need to be able to accelerate and sprint. This is Jacob's weakness at the moment, witness the recent European Indoor 1500. Unless he improves his 800 pb he will be vulnerable in World or Olympic finals unless he can get someone to set a reasonably fast pace (one of his brothers??) as El G did in his prime.

Or he can just wind up from further out (400-500m) like El G used to do. None of those “kickers” would be able to handle that. All those guys sit back and believe they will be the ones to outkick someone else.

You mentioned world indoors, but he brother Filip managed to snag a WC medal in the 1500. Jakob won European champs as well. He outkicked the guy who beat Yomif. We can talk about the level or comp and the circumstances of his opponents all we want but the fact of the matter is that all the brothers do the same training and they are the only medal threats over 1500m other than Willis and Africans. They have produced. They are young. It’s working.

Fair argument. Do you believe that the threshold repetitions eg 5*6min gives them the ability to wind up the pace from 1000m-1100m onwards? Or is it the 2x10x200m hills they complete on a Saturday Morning. Pereven the fact that both of these types of training complement eachother in such a way (with the aid of mileage and track sessions) that makes Jakob so extraordinary and uncomparable to his peers at European level in middle and long distance racing.

lactate burns wrote:

Fair argument. Do you believe that the threshold repetitions eg 5*6min gives them the ability to wind up the pace from 1000m-1100m onwards? Or is it the 2x10x200m hills they complete on a Saturday Morning. Pereven the fact that both of these types of training complement eachother in such a way (with the aid of mileage and track sessions) that makes Jakob so extraordinary and uncomparable to his peers at European level in middle and long distance racing.

I think that both are very important to Ingebrigtsens success.

Focusing more on threshold allows them to do much more volume of high quality work. Especially considering, that in base period they usually do double threshold sessions in the morning and in the evening two days a week. Linked study indicates that threshold running is the type of training that improves running economy the most. Granted the study was done on only moderately trained subjets and sample size is only 40 runners, however, if one thinks about it, it does make sense. VO2max is a variable that is somehow limited, you will reach your max and it will not improve, no matter how much vo2max type of session you will do. On the other hand, running economy is something that keeps improving. See linked article 2 for changes in Paula Radclife's stats over time from 18 year old onwards.

The other, harder sessions of uphill running, I think works on several things, first, it's again running economy as they are going quite fast uphill which teaches body to recruit required muscle fibers optimally. Then, I think (not certain though), the recoveries are quite short and this is the only base period session where they accumulate more than 4mmol lactate, o it's likely a "sort of" VO2max type stimulus and possibly also keeps their anaerobic system somehow moderately stimulated all year long.

It's interesting that despite having no emphasis whatsoever on long run (they appear to be doing 70-90 minutes on Sundays, but at easy for them 3:40-3:50 pace, which is more about time on feet rather than any aerobic stimulus) they are still super solid at 5K and up. Makes me think of how much the long run is needed for middle to 10K runners. Then again, Nick Willis says that there is difference for him doing 18-21 miles compared to 12-14 for long runs.

lactate burns wrote:

Fair argument. Do you believe that the threshold repetitions eg 5*6min gives them the ability to wind up the pace from 1000m-1100m onwards? Or is it the 2x10x200m hills they complete on a Saturday Morning. Pereven the fact that both of these types of training complement eachother in such a way (with the aid of mileage and track sessions) that makes Jakob so extraordinary and uncomparable to his peers at European level in middle and long distance racing.

Yes the threshold helps a lot. By nature the workout helps to buffer lactic acid onset. In a 1500m that build up is all but guaranteed with how long you have to sustain a certain velocity + effort. If two similarly trained 1500 men line up (3:30-3:33 1500m) and one has a threshold of 4:40 (70s lap) and another of 4:50 (72s lap), which would be operating closer to their max running 56s laps for the 1500m? With a race that short and intense, any little bit matters.

They just don’t do hill work either. They also do “sprints.” This is listed about twice a week and you can occasionally find short clips of them doing what looks like flying 80m or sometimes Gert even has a resistance band around their waist as they try to sprint (stupid IMO). They work on their running economy and neuromuscular coordination often. This also allows them to have very smooth, fluid mechanics (as I’m sure you’ve seen) that also allows them to limit energy expenditure at high speeds. All of these factors come together to make their race pace seem much smoother.

Your sprint speed only matters if you aren’t too tired to use it. These guys don’t have natural world class speed so they gotta get real efficient. To be fair, Gert does have them do race specific work like 6 weeks out from the peak race. So not totally threshold+speed. But it is mostly that.

Great thanks,

A few questions because you seem to be very informative.

What months are designated to transition phase / Base / Comp, because Jakob seems to be doing Indoor sessions during January?

How many threshold sessions are done during each of these phases and how are they fitted round the track sessions?

Do the track sessions vary from phase to phase?

do they get faster or shorter throughout the year coming closer to race period?

Do strength and conditioning sessions vary throughout the year?

What sort of weights do they do?

Sorry for the overload

I am the OP this is just my second account

Very good information,

I take from this, that the oxygen uptake at a given pace reduces while your threshold improves. Does you uptake of oxygen decrease from one threshold test to the next while your threshold improves.

EG.

Test 1. 16kmh + X ml/kg/min

Test 2. 17kmh + less than X ml/kg/min

Q- Is this a positive improvement or negative with regard vo2?

If you have any of the answers to the questions I asked to former sub14:00, please answer them if you can

lactate burns wrote:

Great thanks,

A few questions because you seem to be very informative.

What months are designated to transition phase / Base / Comp, because Jakob seems to be doing Indoor sessions during January?

How many threshold sessions are done during each of these phases and how are they fitted round the track sessions?

Do the track sessions vary from phase to phase?

do they get faster or shorter throughout the year coming closer to race period?

Do strength and conditioning sessions vary throughout the year?

What sort of weights do they do?

Sorry for the overload

I don’t know what kind of weights they do but I do know they do them. I have seen pictures of them squating and using kettlebells. To be honest, they do not have “phases” in the traditional sense. Once they build up to mileage they start adding back in their normal routine and literally maintain that all year until when they near competition. At that point they do less threshold sessions and substitute the hills for race pace work.

One of my friends who is younger than I am but was quite and elite American runner went and trained with them last year overseas for 6 weeks. He told me of their schedule and it generally follows what most here have posted. Threshold sessions twice a day, two times a week. Then the hill session.

He said he absolutely got blasted on the hills and it was very difficult for him. He averaged about 17k of threshold on the threshold days. He told me that their days in between were uncomfortable for him to run with them because they went so slowly. They relied A LOT on their HR monitors. At one point they WALKED while going up a hill because their HR climbed too high. They don’t do any real long runs either. He mostly kept up his 18 milers but it wasn’t sustainable with the aerobic workload he was putting in. During that period he claimed he was the most fit aerobically he had ever been in his life.

It’s a very monontous and not so sexy system but it seems to work. The only transition phases there are is the period where workouts are included again and the period where they back off to get ready to peak.

LateRunnerPhil wrote:

Exactly. He trains at 2.5-3.5 mmol (lactate) pace, which for him is around 1 hour (3.5) to 2 hours (2.5) pace.

Every given day, his pace at 3.5 mmol is different, depending on fuel status, how he feels, how recovered/fatigued he is etc.

I wish lactate testing was more prominent in the US high school/D1 scene, as it's super beneficial to train at the optimal paces.

I bet Coe did something similar as a junior

Thank you so much, I am going to guess their training on a weekly basis looks something like this.

Mon AM - 10km

Mon PM - 10km, Weights + Core

Tue AM - 5 x 6min Threshold (60s)

Tue PM - 25 x 400m Threshold (30s)

Wed AM - 5 x 6min Threshold (60s)

Wed PM - 10km, 8x80fly + Stairjumps etc.

Thu AM - 5 x 6min Threshold (60s)

Thu PM - 10 x 1000m Threshold (60s)

Fri AM - 10km

Fri PM - 10km, Weights + Core

Sat AM - 2 x 10 x 200m Hills (4min)

Sat PM - Recovery

Sun AM - 20km

Sun PM - Recovery

What are their saturday track sessions, excluding the 5x2x300m in ~39, are there any others?

And if, during a threshold session, their heart rate went above say 92% or their lactate went to 3.6mmol/l what do they do, slow down/stop?