I'm running slow at every meet - 16 year old male

No, you are weak all around.

Don't take a week off randomly after indoor and this won't happen. You lost significant fitness.

did you run more than 30 mpw during indoor, when you set your PR?

If you dropped your miles and took a week off, it can take some time to get it back. yeah pros take several weeks off, but they are gods. We are mortals, and some of us can't afford to take all that time off.

The other thing is that running is not linear, PRing at steady intervals. We tend to have big breakthroughs, then stagnate, then have another big breakthrough. it's the game. But surely if your coach agrees, a 16 year old can usually handle and improve by running 40 per week.

agip wrote:

did you run more than 30 mpw during indoor, when you set your PR?

If you dropped your miles and took a week off, it can take some time to get it back. yeah pros take several weeks off, but they are gods. We are mortals, and some of us can't afford to take all that time off.

The other thing is that running is not linear, PRing at steady intervals. We tend to have big breakthroughs, then stagnate, then have another big breakthrough. it's the game. But surely if your coach agrees, a 16 year old can usually handle and improve by running 40 per week.

Pros take several weeks off? Unless they are injured the don't even take one day off.

SDSU Aztec wrote:

agip wrote:

did you run more than 30 mpw during indoor, when you set your PR?

If you dropped your miles and took a week off, it can take some time to get it back. yeah pros take several weeks off, but they are gods. We are mortals, and some of us can't afford to take all that time off.

The other thing is that running is not linear, PRing at steady intervals. We tend to have big breakthroughs, then stagnate, then have another big breakthrough. it's the game. But surely if your coach agrees, a 16 year old can usually handle and improve by running 40 per week.

Pros take several weeks off? Unless they are injured the don't even take one day off.

For example:

"Bernard Lagat, who was fourth in the London Olympic 5000-meter final, is in New York for Saturday’s Fifth Avenue Mile. But after that event, he’ll do something that few elite runners, or even few of the folks reading this, would dare do. He’ll take five weeks off from running. And he’ll gain eight pounds. And be very happy."

Willis just runs easy for a few weeks each year, no workouts.

I didn't mean to suggest all pros take time off. But there is a range of off-season behaviors among pros.

SDSU Aztec wrote:

agip wrote:

did you run more than 30 mpw during indoor, when you set your PR?

If you dropped your miles and took a week off, it can take some time to get it back. yeah pros take several weeks off, but they are gods. We are mortals, and some of us can't afford to take all that time off.

The other thing is that running is not linear, PRing at steady intervals. We tend to have big breakthroughs, then stagnate, then have another big breakthrough. it's the game. But surely if your coach agrees, a 16 year old can usually handle and improve by running 40 per week.

Pros take several weeks off? Unless they are injured the don't even take one day off.

some more stories. Says Rowbury doesn't run for two-three weeks each year.

agip wrote:

did you run more than 30 mpw during indoor, when you set your PR?

If you dropped your miles and took a week off, it can take some time to get it back. yeah pros take several weeks off, but they are gods. We are mortals, and some of us can't afford to take all that time off.

The other thing is that running is not linear, PRing at steady intervals. We tend to have big breakthroughs, then stagnate, then have another big breakthrough. it's the game. But surely if your coach agrees, a 16 year old can usually handle and improve by running 40 per week.

I've talked to my coach about increasing my mileage, and she said that I may work my way up to that mileage, but she would want to do it progressively over the season, which makes sense. Otherwise, I was running the same mileage in winter. When I ran my PR, it was my first time going sub-5, my previous PR was a 5:04. So it was a huge PR.

When I was your age I had no clue about how to warm up for a race, so my times were way slower than what I was capable of. I think this applies to most young runners.

ok well keep your chin up and do what your coach tells you. She got you to your big PR, so she'll get you back there. Best thing you can do is have faith in the process and work on making those 400s seem as smooth as possible. See how easily you can run at mile pace in workouts. When you start breathing hard and straining, take a deep breath and see if you can chill...see if you can run the same pace with less drama and facial expressions.

Goal is to learn to run at 74 seconds per 400 with the least amount of stress possible.

something to think about wrote:

When I was your age I had no clue about how to warm up for a race, so my times were way slower than what I was capable of. I think this applies to most young runners.

yeah, that. And be smarter than the average HSer running the mile at 70/72/78/73 or whatever. Be the smart guy.

PR @ 16 5.17 (on grass) for 1500m

PR @ 34 4.18

PR @ 40 4.06

PR @ 43 4.00

So what was I really I capable of @ 16? 4.15- 4.20?

agip wrote:

something to think about wrote:

When I was your age I had no clue about how to warm up for a race, so my times were way slower than what I was capable of. I think this applies to most young runners.

yeah, that. And be smarter than the average HSer running the mile at 70/72/78/73 or whatever. Be the smart guy.

My splits in my PR race were 71, 75, 75, 70. One issue that I have when racing is that I have too much left in the last lap. I tend to slow down in my second or third lap, and wait until the last lap to crank one out fast. I have trouble with even splitting. Even splitting comes down to practice right?

Are these 1500m times, or full mile?

FelixSprock wrote:

agip wrote:

yeah, that. And be smarter than the average HSer running the mile at 70/72/78/73 or whatever. Be the smart guy.

My splits in my PR race were 71, 75, 75, 70. One issue that I have when racing is that I have too much left in the last lap. I tend to slow down in my second or third lap, and wait until the last lap to crank one out fast. I have trouble with even splitting. Even splitting comes down to practice right?

Racing is an art...meaning there is not just one way to do it. Each of us races differently. So don't let anyone force you into thinking there is one way to do it.

At age 16 you should experiment and see what works. One race go out hard, the next go out slow, the next push the middle laps, another just stick to the back of someone who is ahead of you in practice. One race try running even, sure.

The one thing I will say is that the best racers are...racers. They don't care so much about the clock...they just want to run fast in groups and compete. That attitude will get you the PRs and the race wins.

Even-splitting is the most efficient use of energy, yes..but it won't win you many races, unless you are the fastest guy in the field.

So try a few things and see what works.

...that said, a smart HSers can beat a lot of people if she or he is brave and tough enough to run 3-4 seconds behind the insane pace at the front of the pack. If you can save those 3-4 seconds of energy and use them on lap 3, you will have a big advantage. You will be maintaining speed while the guys or girls who went out too fast will be slowing. that's a huge advantage to you.

The catch is that if you go out at an appropriate speed, you have to have the mental strength to close the gap on laps 2 and 3. Not everyone can do that. Many will settle in and not recover those 3 seconds.

Some coaches will start a runner 2-3 seconds behind a group during intervals and instruct him or her to slowly close the gap. So you have practice doing that.

FelixSprock wrote:

Are these 1500m times, or full mile?

1500

We didn't do 1600 or full mile.

My point is that most young people are much better runners than they know. The fastest runners are very intimidating to race against and this makes you anxious when you race and slows you down a lot.

agip wrote:

...that said, a smart HSers can beat a lot of people if she or he is brave and tough enough to run 3-4 seconds behind the insane pace at the front of the pack. If you can save those 3-4 seconds of energy and use them on lap 3, you will have a big advantage. You will be maintaining speed while the guys or girls who went out too fast will be slowing. that's a huge advantage to you.

The catch is that if you go out at an appropriate speed, you have to have the mental strength to close the gap on laps 2 and 3. Not everyone can do that. Many will settle in and not recover those 3 seconds.

Some coaches will start a runner 2-3 seconds behind a group during intervals and instruct him or her to slowly close the gap. So you have practice doing that.

Really good advice, thank you! My next race is Thursday, next week. I'm going to be racing the boy's mile against a stacked field of most 4:20-4:40 milers. I'll take your advice and just try to race the race. Ill try to stick with the front pack/middle pack and push it on lap 3. I'm excited to try this out!

When does the fastest guy not when the race? The only scenarios I can think of is a huge positive split or a pace that is slow enough that a guy with better top end speed can win with a kick.

it can win the race, sure. but the problem is what I wrote above...that even splitting a HS race means you will be 4 seconds behind at 400 meters. Two seconds back at 800. You have to be very strong mentally to be able to close that in lap 3, running on your own. I'm 100% for even splitting if you are that strong mentally. Few are.

Most benefit more from the adrenaline of racing people to get PRs.