It is unreasonable for me to aim to get under 12 minutes in a 3k next week?

12 x 400 with 60 sec rest by the way

I don't think so, as long as "next week" isn't until many months from now.

Ok fair. What time should I aim for then? I have no clue what pace I should go out at.

You can't be too far off. You could definitely run sub 12 on your 390-meter track.

The problem is, the race is not on the track. Does going out at 6:35-6:40 pace sound reasonable or will I crash and burn?

That workout (12x400 at your (goal?) mile race pace with 1 min rest) is complete garbage - way too intense!! Even some elites wouldn't be able to handle that. The fact alone that you were able to handle that suggests you got great speed for your level and are extremely underdeveloped aerobically.

Same with 5k tempo runs - if you think you are more fast-twitch oriented, don't run a straight threshold run, break them up in smaller piece - like 2 mile, mile, mile with short rests in between (Magness has done all the research do optimize training for fast-twitch athletes).

It hurts to see how hard you are training all the time without getting any results in races. Train easier, keep the ball rolling and don't do any hero-training sessions. Keep that for races!

With the right training you will not just run 12 min for a 3k, but able to eventually break 11 min. That would already be a terrific time for a girl.

In my opinion you should talk to your coach and develop a long-term plan, rather than chasing short-term goals like breaking 12 min 3k next week. Good luck with your running career!

It didn’t feel super super inetnse like if I had a gun to my head I probably could have done 15 reps or so but must admit, I was pretty out of breath by the end lol.

I do my 3-4 mile tempo/threshold runs anywhere between 7:20 pace and 7:40 pace and my longer tempos 4-6 miles anywhere between 7:40-8:00 pace. I enjoy these runs and I find them hard, harder than busting out endless intervals at 6 min pace (I’m guessing that’s because I’m speed orientated) whereas my teammates who are more endurance based die on the short intervals but are able to stay more comfortable on the tempos, I am always heavy breathing on tempos but during fast repeats my form is good and I look easy and relaxed where others are cleaning straining.

I feel like our coach coaches us all the same, I am the only one on our team with a soccer background, the rest of them are only runners. I don’t play soccer anymore because I disliked my teammates but I am guessing that is why I am speed orientated.

Thanks for your advice, I will try 4 x 2k reps at 7:20-7:30 pace, sounds like a fun workout. For me it would feel like a mix between tempos and intervals.

You'll be close I bet so just start at 12-flat pace and see what happens. If its a little too fast, I doubt you'll blow up that hard cause you sound like you'd at least be really close, JMO.

I was similar to you - lots of speed but no endurance. You just need to make sure you train the right way, and you will be a great distance runner. You got everything that's needed - good running form, lots of motivation to improve (otherwise you wouldn't post here) and still young.

If you train a lot with your team, make sure to always HOLD back during any interval work/tempo runs/long runs. Save that for racing! Especially as fast-twitch athlete that's very important.

A schedule for 40 mpw (that's a lot of mileage, you should be able to run quite a bit faster off that) could be:

monday - long run, 8 miles easy, around 9:00/mile pace (same pace for easy runs)

tuesday - easy 5 miles

wednesday - CV workout 3-4x1000m in 7:00-7:05 pace, short 200m rest + 3-4x200m in 45.

thursday - easy 5 miles

friday - easy 5 miles

saturday - race or tempo run, 4-6 miles in 7:40-8:00 or threshold intervals, 3x2000m in 7:20-7:30 (not 4x, instead do a mile warm-up and cd). follow each tempo run with 4x30s hill charges

sunday - off

you can add striders or pickups to any easy run, like 6x15s or 5x20s etc. no all-out sprinting, but doing a good solid effort at high speed working on turnover and form.

if you do 400s with your team, make sure to run them slower and try to do more reps - that's how you build your stamina (for example 15x400 at 105s is better than 10x400 in 90s for you). when doing 1k or 2k repeats, always end the workout feeling you could do 1-2 more reps with ease. same with tempo runs - keep breathing controlled, even if it means running slower.

the problem with running hard is that you train the wrong systems (anaerobic running, lactate tolerance) instead of what you need the most at the moment (endurance, stamina).

you truly seem to enjoy running, so make sure to run smart and results will follow. i advise against going out at 12:00 min pace, go out at 12:30-13:00 pace and then pick it up in the end if you feel good.

0.5 mile warm up

3 x 2k

9:04

9:04

8:53

0.5 mile cool down

2 min walk rest

Race in 4 days, weights tomorrow but after that resting up and doing only easy runs until my race. I’m thinking I should aim for under 13 as opposed to under 12, didn’t realise how far off from my goal I was /: oh well, onwards and upwards in the future✌??‍♂️ Thank you for your advice LetsRun, my coach agrees that the 2k intervals would be good for me.

good luck with your race! please keep us updated on how it went.

i would also go out at sub 13 pace, maybe run with a pack and then try to use your strength (speed from all the soccer training) in a kick where you outrun others and finish strong!

Kazzina wrote:

I’m thinking I should aim for under 13 as opposed to under 12, didn’t realise how far off from my goal I was .

No, you are not far off. I would go out at 6:15 or so, and see if you can pick it up the last few laps.

6:15 would be mile race pace for me ?

If this was a 2k race I would probably agree but my endurance is mediocre at best (to give you idea if how much I suck my 5k to 10k conversion is about 22/48 minutes). Im stressing trying to decide what pace to out at, I’m still at the stage where holding sub 7 pace feels overwhelming for any considerable amount of time. I wish I had longer to prepare for this race :( arghh???

I would jump for joy if I managed 2 miles in under 14 minutes so I’m thinking the only sensible option is to go out at 6:40 pace for the first mile and then go all out from there and see where I land. :)