Planning on doing 20x400 workout at conservative 8k race pace. How much rest should I take between reps? Open to both static and active recovery. Trying to make this workout a decent effort but by no means really hard since I'm still in base training. Thanks.
-JW
At that pace, rest should only be a 100m jog.
120bpm
why not do the first 10 at 10k pace and the last 10 at 5k pace with 1 min jog rest
big man on campus wrote:
why not do the first 10 at 10k pace and the last 10 at 5k pace with 1 min jog rest
Or even better:
4 x 5 x 400m
first set@ 10k pace
second set @ 5k pace
third set @ 3k pace
last set @ mile pace
rest:
first set 100m jog
400m jog beteen set
second set 200m jog
800m jog between set
third set 200m jog
1600m jog between set
last set 400m jog
1 minute or less.
I usually do mine at 5K pace with no recovery.
Lydiard Cerutty wrote:
big man on campus wrote:
why not do the first 10 at 10k pace and the last 10 at 5k pace with 1 min jog rest
Or even better:
4 x 5 x 400m
first set@ 10k pace
second set @ 5k pace
third set @ 3k pace
last set @ mile pace
rest:
first set 100m jog
400m jog beteen set
second set 200m jog
800m jog between set
third set 200m jog
1600m jog between set
last set 400m jog
In early August?
Are you crazy?
John Wick wrote:
Planning on doing 20x400 workout at conservative 8k race pace. How much rest should I take between reps? Open to both static and active recovery. Trying to make this workout a decent effort but by no means really hard since I'm still in base training. Thanks.
-JW
Then the very best rest for you will be walk easy down to 120 bpm or 60% of MHR.
It will give your body and heart the perfect individual rest. Just test it once and you will never regret .
It`s so super effective!
Magic,magic…….Yeeah, I told you so …..he is really magic!
- The Wizard -
What is going on in such a workout if you start the 400s faster than you end? Is that ok????.. and one day you'll keep your pace for longer, and then a little longer etc.; Or should you run slower and more evenly (in which case they often degenerate into the same pace as a consistent run)....
SUPERIOR COACH JS wrote:
John Wick wrote:
Planning on doing 20x400 workout at conservative 8k race pace. How much rest should I take between reps? Open to both static and active recovery. Trying to make this workout a decent effort but by no means really hard since I'm still in base training. Thanks.
-JW
Then the very best rest for you will be walk easy down to 120 bpm or 60% of MHR.
It will give your body and heart the perfect individual rest. Just test it once and you will never regret .
It`s so super effective!
Magic,magic…….Yeeah, I told you so …..he is really magic!
- The Wizard -
Do you feel that this approach can be impacted by the temperature? There is a heat wave in Europe now and I would say that it would take a very long time for my heart rate to get down to 60% max when running intervals under hot conditions. I also notice that if I bend over putting my hands on my knees after a repetition or even lie down then my heart rate will go down much faster than if I was to walk which would shorten the recovery in the workout by a fair amount of time.
Interested Reader wrote:
SUPERIOR COACH JS wrote:
Then the very best rest for you will be walk easy down to 120 bpm or 60% of MHR.
It will give your body and heart the perfect individual rest. Just test it once and you will never regret .
It`s so super effective!
Magic,magic…….Yeeah, I told you so …..he is really magic!
- The Wizard -
Do you feel that this approach can be impacted by the temperature? There is a heat wave in Europe now and I would say that it would take a very long time for my heart rate to get down to 60% max when running intervals under hot conditions. I also notice that if I bend over putting my hands on my knees after a repetition or even lie down then my heart rate will go down much faster than if I was to walk which would shorten the recovery in the workout by a fair amount of time.
First time I heard that pulse will go down much slower when hot temperature. I myself ran often 20 x 400m at 68 sec when hot and never notice any difference in recovery down to 120 bpm . But I was a very good heat tolerant runner. Of course you can lie down between the reps if that gives you a faster recovery down to 120 bpm or 60% of MHR, that was what W. Gerschler`s runners did. But the very best rest between reps is to use the leg muscles and keep up the level of lactate by walking or jogging. No, I would rather advice you to calibrate the pace a little bit slower instead when hot conditions for you, that should make the heartrate to come down normal time to 60% of MHR or 120 bpm when walking easy between reps. Also if possible try to do your workout when the sun is as weakest .Test this and come back to me how it went please. Good luck!
ChangedBaby wrote:
What is going on in such a workout if you start the 400s faster than you end? Is that ok????.. and one day you'll keep your pace for longer, and then a little longer etc.; Or should you run slower and more evenly (in which case they often degenerate into the same pace as a consistent run)....
No,... That is not ok.Then you miss the meaning of the workout, to keep the pace constant at 5 K race pace and only get more pressure from the pace the more reps you run. If you start out fast and slower at the end the last reps will be just "junk reps ". You have a present 5K race pace , and that is the best pace for you to hold the entire workout.
John Wick wrote:
Planning on doing 20x400 workout at conservative 8k race pace. How much rest should I take between reps? Open to both static and active recovery. Trying to make this workout a decent effort but by no means really hard since I'm still in base training. Thanks.
-JW
I'd suggest 200m 'float' recovery. The 200 metres is because it'll be easier for you to judge your where to start/stop your reps. Since the workout is not very intense i recommend that you don't jog the recovery, but rather keep the turnover and run it at a steady effort.
Excuse me for the extra 'your'.
For the 200m recovery, the rest time works out to around 50 seconds (6:40 pace). This is of course based upon you making sure that you run it at exactly 8k race pace, otherwise the intensity will be higher than recommended.
This isn't a base training workout.
It is great before the sharpening phase though. I run them at 5k race pace. Cross the finish line, walk for about 100m then jog 100m then rip another one. If training for something longer I like to jog a lap to get the mileage effect higher. Usually top out at 16x for 5ks and 20x for longer races, adjusting pace accordingly. HR should always return to a resting rate, I want mine under 100 before another go. Can be a bit higher depending on weather.
Lydiard Cerutty wrote:
big man on campus wrote:
why not do the first 10 at 10k pace and the last 10 at 5k pace with 1 min jog rest
Or even better:
4 x 5 x 400m
first set@ 10k pace
second set @ 5k pace
third set @ 3k pace
last set @ mile pace
rest:
first set 100m jog
400m jog beteen set
second set 200m jog
800m jog between set
third set 200m jog
1600m jog between set
last set 400m jog
This way of handle the workout 20 x 400m can be good, but only when the purpose is another
than improve the runners ability to keep up an even 5K race pace for the entire distance.
Running the workout progressive faster , and then preferable in sets, should only be used when preparing for a very important race 5K/10K where it can be expected for a need of a very fast finish.
The great Joshua Cheptegei , who I sometimes chat with, told me he use to run 20 x 400m that way when preparing for the championships. Then he do them like this : 5 sets of 4 x 400m , 3 min jog between sets, 1 min walk between reps.
First set at 65 sec, second set at 64 sec, third set 60-61 sec and last set 58-59 sec . He is very fast in a race finish.
Sorry...even I write wrong sometimes…..of course it is 58-59 sec in 4th and 5th set.