I'd say two per team, max. The teams should be U.S. runner dominant, which would mean no more than 2 potential foreign scorers per team.
I'd say two per team, max. The teams should be U.S. runner dominant, which would mean no more than 2 potential foreign scorers per team.
why?
"You realize why people in the western world have so much difficulty competing with these guys," Skiba said. "These guys don't have any Facebook or Twitter. They run in the morning, eat, sleep, run more. There are dirt roads. There was an old red dirt track, which was uneven and had plants growing out of it. Here you have the fastest (distance runner) alive, and he's using a plastic bottle to indicate where to start (a run). It had a very 'Rocky' vibe."
Just why... wrote:
why?
This is strictly opinion, but several reasons I'm of this opinion are as follows:
1. These are U.S. colleges, many of which are supported by U.S. taxpayer dollars, and thus should be giving the majority of opportunities to compete for these colleges to our own children
2. If we hold to point #1, private universities should hold to these limitations as well, otherwise they would have an unfair competitive advantage
3. Since this is U.S. national college competition, the preponderance of influence on this competition should be home grown, not imported, if we are going to determine the best team in OUR country. Is U of X really the best U.S. college team if no one from the U.S. represents?
I'm not saying no foreigners, in fact, I think it's great to have some aboard, as they can motivate our own to strive to reach for greater heights, but let's not allow them to have the potential to significantly diminish the opportunities our own kids can have to compete at this level and influence team outcomes.
OP, why not take your logic further... For state schools, why not proclaim that a "foreigner" is anyone born outside the state. This way U of Oregon can only have a max of 2 people born outside of Oregon? Right? That would limit the amount of taxpayer dollars paid by the good people of Oregon that goes to out of state ringers, recruited to Oregon just because they happen to run fast.
Just stupid... wrote:
OP, why not take your logic further... For state schools, why not proclaim that a "foreigner" is anyone born outside the state. This way U of Oregon can only have a max of 2 people born outside of Oregon? Right? That would limit the amount of taxpayer dollars paid by the good people of Oregon that goes to out of state ringers, recruited to Oregon just because they happen to run fast.
I knew someone would bring this up, and my response to that is, because this is a NATIONAL collegiate system of competition. If competition was set up in to be intra-state, then I would agree that U of Oregon should have to predominantly recruit from within to compete with other Oregon schools.
Just wow... wrote:
Just why... wrote:why?
This is strictly opinion, but several reasons I'm of this opinion are as follows:
1. These are U.S. colleges, many of which are supported by U.S. taxpayer dollars, and thus should be giving the majority of opportunities to compete for these colleges to our own children
2. If we hold to point #1, private universities should hold to these limitations as well, otherwise they would have an unfair competitive advantage
3. Since this is U.S. national college competition, the preponderance of influence on this competition should be home grown, not imported, if we are going to determine the best team in OUR country. Is U of X really the best U.S. college team if no one from the U.S. represents?
I'm not saying no foreigners, in fact, I think it's great to have some aboard, as they can motivate our own to strive to reach for greater heights, but let's not allow them to have the potential to significantly diminish the opportunities our own kids can have to compete at this level and influence team outcomes.
If "our kids" aren't good enough, better they learn that sooner rather than later.
It's not about being "good enough" (on the world scene, as you're implying). It's about giving them an opportunity to enjoy competitive running in college on a national level. I don't think this opportunity should be taken from our own kids just because of the greed of colleges to seek to stack their teams with international talent just to win at all costs.
If the OP rule was activated, how would you determine who is a foreigner? Kelati (UNM) graduated from a US high school. Is she a foreign or domestic runner? If she is still considered foreign, at what age would they have to move to US in order to be considered domestic?
My niece was born in Germany and has dual citizenship - she lived in the US from age 3-10, but has been back in Germany since. She will not have a US HS diploma, but will be applying to US colleges next year. Would she be considered a foreign or domestic runner?
Also, why limit participation to 2 foreign runners? Why not 1? Or why not 3?
Would your rule be only for NCAA XC/TF, or would it apply to all other NCAA sports? Can the NCAA treat XC/TF differently than other sports? Some other NCAA sports (see tennis and gymnastics) also have a bit of this "problem."
For the 8,000,000th time, the NCAA is a league of colleges IN one nation, not a watered-down league for college students FROM one nation. Step up and compete, or don't, but either way quit whining that you lost.
Just wow... wrote:
I'd say two per team, max. The teams should be U.S. runner dominant, which would mean no more than 2 potential foreign scorers per team.
We don't agree
Nothing is being taken from our kids. If you are good enough you make the team. Maybe American kids can put down the x box, stop sending their SAAC members to NCAA meeting demanding more scholarship and less practice hours. Maybe the NCAA coaches should be able to take scholarship easier from kids that get to college and party hard because "that's what other college kids do". Should be quite a few changes. Not sure reducing international athletes is the right answer.
If when you talk about US taxpayers supporting foreign athletes with scholarships you're incorrect. Athletic scholarships are funded by revenue from the athletic departments, donations from alumni and supporters, etc. It costs say, New Jersey's taxpayers no more to bring in a kid from Kenya than one from Kentucky and in fact, both of those kids will cost New Jersey's taxpayers less money than a New Jersey kid will because the state of New Jersey will pay a portion of the in state kid's tuition and will not do so for the kids from Kenya or Kentucky.
If you simply mean that US kids should have a chance to run for a college team, they all do. They just need ti be good enough to run at a particular school and if they aren't they need to find a school that they can run for. That's the case in any sport. When James Franklin was playing high school football he wanted very much to play in college for Penn State. He wasn't good enough so he went to East Stroudsburg. I'd have loved to run for Villanova when I was in high school but was no where near good enough. So I went someplace else.
Please keep letting the foreigners compete I want to see good races.
Just wow... wrote:
It's not about being "good enough" (on the world scene, as you're implying). It's about giving them an opportunity to enjoy competitive running in college on a national level. I don't think this opportunity should be taken from our own kids just because of the greed of colleges to seek to stack their teams with international talent just to win at all costs.
That's why they invented NCAA division 2 and 3. Everybody can be a winner. Yeah... everybody is special...
I guess, but I'd imagine that many potentially talented rising high-schoolers in the U.S. are less motivated to try to continue to compete at a high level in college knowing that many of the schools they'd like to run at are recruiting guys from other countries that are better than almost all of our nations top guys.
Cdtftyytyggyt wrote:
Just wow... wrote:It's not about being "good enough" (on the world scene, as you're implying). It's about giving them an opportunity to enjoy competitive running in college on a national level. I don't think this opportunity should be taken from our own kids just because of the greed of colleges to seek to stack their teams with international talent just to win at all costs.
That's why they invented NCAA division 2 and 3. Everybody can be a winner. Yeah... everybody is special...
Competition is an American value. The US is supposed to be the place where the best in the world come to compete.
And I agree. I think it's good to have SOME international talent here, but I do not want entire teams representing our colleges to be Kenyan recruits. These guys are already running 13:00 at age "16", and can let their own systems bring them along just fine.
And I completely agree with you about competition being an American value. National championship events are about competing for who is the very best in our nation, of our own, in preparation for mixing it up with the rest of the world. That's how I believe the NCAA should be thinking as well.
As a former athlete I always wanted to compete against the best. That's how we (USA) will improve. We are trying to make"everyone's a winner". Dr VanAaken once told me that if you make the criteria narrow enough everyone is a world record holder. This morning I set the world record for a 68 year old male, under 125 pounds by running 27.4 km in 2:43 I'm so proud of myself. Don't baby or limit the potential of our youth. We are the greatest country in the world if we don't talk ourselves out of it.