800/1500 Indoor shape prediction

Really hard to say. With the 200's I'd say around 1:57-1:58 but your strength is pretty good and that 600m workout it solid. So you could be ~1:55, give or take depending on the race and how you feel.

bump?

any more ideas?

I'd say 1:55 if all goes well

Next workout

200-400-800-600 (2/4/6 Minutes rest)

30-60-2:02-1:31

Running a 2:02 feeling reasonably relaxed gives me quite a bit of confidence, especially for 1500. I feel like I lack straight line speed for a proper fast 800 at the moment ..

Any comments especially regarding 1500 shape come February?

vlt. wrote:

Next workout

200-400-800-600 (2/4/6 Minutes rest)

30-60-2:02-1:31

Running a 2:02 feeling reasonably relaxed gives me quite a bit of confidence, especially for 1500. I feel like I lack straight line speed for a proper fast 800 at the moment ..

Any comments especially regarding 1500 shape come February?

That's a pretty solid workout. I agree that your 800 might not be under 1:54-1:56 right now because your top speed isn't super high right now, but it makes more sense for you to be in better mile shape this time of year and work on the speed as the year goes on.

Assuming you are doing your tempos and at least okay mileage, I'd say you'll be sub 4 for the 1500 at least. Maybe closer to 3:55, but its hard to tell since it was a low volume workout. I had teammates running around 2 miles worth of 400 and 600 repeats at 60-61 and 1:30-1:32 and they were 3:48-3:52 guys, but they also had 2-3 minutes between repeats, not as much as you had.

So i'd say you are well on your way, and that you should at minimum be sub 4, but potentially faster, especially by that point.

Initially my coach told me to go out in 54/55, of which I was quite sceptical as this would suggest he thinks I'm in shape for a 1:52 or so. We agreed on 55/56 but this gave me a a fair amount of confidence prior to the race.

Turns out, I was the only one there aiming to run as fast and decided I wuold need to front-run the 800.

Hit 200 in 28-high, realised that this was too slow, panicked and followed it up with a 27-high for a 56.2 at 400. Went through 600 in 1.25-low and imploded on the last lap to run a 1:58..

Certainly not what I'd hoped for.

Don't worry about that, it'll come around with more races. You'll remember how to prepare yourself mentally and not have those lapses in focus.

All the workouts you list have quite lengthy recoveries between the efforts.

1:54 is 4x200 in 28.5 second with NO RECOVERY. Running significantly faster than this pace with long recoveries does not necessarily prepare you for the race - even though it does have some training value in other ways.

Try 2x4x200 @ goal pace with 30 seconds between eforts anf 5-7 minutes between sets.

Coaches are good at doing that. Whether they think you can actually go that fast, its good for our confidence to hear them think that. Not to controdict your coach or anyone else, but you have to make sure you run the race that is best for yourself.

I've run race very similar to the one you just ran. No one wanted to go out, it was 20 degrees and windy. Our first 200 was about 30, then this kid took off and I followed him and we split a 27 for our second 200. That was the hardest 57 I ever ran. Hung on for 1:26 through 600 and died to a 1:58. On that same day I probably could have run a 1:55 with more even splits and relaxed racing. Often times it is all about running the race that works best for you.

Next time, instead of thinking that 28 is too slow, remember that 28.XX is 1:52-1:56 pace and thats pretty solid. Just because some of the best times were run off of negative splits doesn't mean it always has to be that way. Just remain relaxed and keep winding up the pace and reinvesting when things get tough. Based on how you ran that race you probably could have managed a 1:55 with more even and relaxed pacing.

Great post, this is what I was trying to communicate.

Literallyshocked wrote:

Great post, this is what I was trying to communicate.

Thank you.

And re-reading my post, I meant to say "positive splits" instead of "negative splits" in the part about how to run races.

Figure I may as well turn this into a log of workouts. Mileage is relatively low around 35-45mpw now around 6:40 to 6:20 on non workout days.

400-1000-400-200-200-200 w 5/6/5/2/2 minutes rest

60-2:34-58-28-27-27

Kind of afraid of either peaking too soon or overtraining. On the other hand, the season will be over in 6 weeks and I need to run fast before then.

Running a 1500 next, curious to see what happens.

You ran a 2:34 in practice? Holy crap.

A lot of your workouts seem like the difficult long rest workouts that are usually used for more towards the end of season, but if you only have 6 weeks left it may not be terrible. I'm interested to see how you do in the 1500. Like I said, theres not a lot of endurance workouts but the workouts you are doing are very solid.

ThatAverageRunner wrote:

You ran a 2:34 in practice? Holy crap.

A lot of your workouts seem like the difficult long rest workouts that are usually used for more towards the end of season, but if you only have 6 weeks left it may not be terrible. I'm interested to see how you do in the 1500. Like I said, theres not a lot of endurance workouts but the workouts you are doing are very solid.

I really dont think that the crap the comes out of someones backside is holy. I dont think you should say holy crap. It should be crap. YOu idiot

no, not so fast.... wrote:

ThatAverageRunner wrote:

You ran a 2:34 in practice? Holy crap.

A lot of your workouts seem like the difficult long rest workouts that are usually used for more towards the end of season, but if you only have 6 weeks left it may not be terrible. I'm interested to see how you do in the 1500. Like I said, theres not a lot of endurance workouts but the workouts you are doing are very solid.

I really dont think that the crap the comes out of someones backside is holy. I dont think you should say holy crap. It should be crap. YOu idiot

0/10

ThatAverageRunner wrote:

You ran a 2:34 in practice? Holy crap.

A lot of your workouts seem like the difficult long rest workouts that are usually used for more towards the end of season, but if you only have 6 weeks left it may not be terrible. I'm interested to see how you do in the 1500. Like I said, theres not a lot of endurance workouts but the workouts you are doing are very solid.

I almost feel like every one of these workouts is supposed to simulate race effort with a couple hard reps and lots of rest. I'm just not sure that's the best way to build fitness, at least for the 1500. Why not bring the 5 and 6 minute rests down to 3 or 3.5 and run a tad slower.

LotsOrest wrote:

ThatAverageRunner wrote:

You ran a 2:34 in practice? Holy crap.

A lot of your workouts seem like the difficult long rest workouts that are usually used for more towards the end of season, but if you only have 6 weeks left it may not be terrible. I'm interested to see how you do in the 1500. Like I said, theres not a lot of endurance workouts but the workouts you are doing are very solid.

I almost feel like every one of these workouts is supposed to simulate race effort with a couple hard reps and lots of rest. I'm just not sure that's the best way to build fitness, at least for the 1500. Why not bring the 5 and 6 minute rests down to 3 or 3.5 and run a tad slower.

well, he's not really in charge of his workouts, his coach is. He's also peaking for 5-6 weeks from now after a long aerobic build up from the fall and early winter so he's probably fine.

Bonkers wrote:

LotsOrest wrote:

I almost feel like every one of these workouts is supposed to simulate race effort with a couple hard reps and lots of rest. I'm just not sure that's the best way to build fitness, at least for the 1500. Why not bring the 5 and 6 minute rests down to 3 or 3.5 and run a tad slower.

well, he's not really in charge of his workouts, his coach is. He's also peaking for 5-6 weeks from now after a long aerobic build up from the fall and early winter so he's probably fine.

Maybe. But it's probably more of a minor peak as his true end of season is probably mid to late may. I'm sure this peak isn't meant to be as extreme because it's indoors. But yeah I get that he's not in charge of his own workouts, I'm not either.

Was ill for the past week and am still nursing a slight cough which will probably remain throughout the indoor season.

Took a week off doing only 40-50 minutes of easy running on most days, with two days of complete rest.

Started workouts again yesterday.

2x(1000-200-200) w 2'/2' and 8' between sets

2:40/29/29

2:37/29/28

(200s were supposed to be "easy"/ controlled effort).

Remarkably, I felt surprisingly in control and for once wasn't completely destroyed afterwards. I rather had the feeling that I had problems getting into the right mindset and into gears.

Be that as it may, cruising a 2:40 and 2:37 is something I haven't done in previous years, although in hindsight I probably could have gone a bit faster on the second rep.

Curious to see what happens next.