Karnazes and Reed: A New Level of hatred, scorn, and ignorance.

Pam Reed and Dean Karnazes have evoked an outpouring of emotions like I have never seen on letsrun.com before. It surfaces every time the 'people who run ultras aren't really runners, blah blah blah yak yak yak' theme surfaces, but this round is setting new standards of hatred, scorn, and ignorance. Hatred almost always comes clothed in ignorance.

The hate is based on...

The unfairness of them appearing on national television?

The unfairness of having an autobiography published?

The unfairness of being on a magazine cover?

The unfairness of finding an agent that found a market?

The unfairness of finding a way to juggle life and running--seemingly successfully?

The act of running somewhere other than on a track or carefully certified stretch of paved roadway?

Their failure to be 'real' runners. One standard for being a 'real' runner being a sub-2:40 marathon. Quick, someone run and erase John Kelly's name from all those lists of Boston finishers.

Their failure to not run as fast as the 'real' runners on letsrun.com?

Neither of them claims to be the best in the ultra community, but here on letsrun it's as if they have demanded USATF, IAAF, NRA, NASCAR, and USDA sainthood.

They ran for the love of running long before their encounters at Badwater.

Reed represented the U.S. at the 24-hour events--again, not 'real' running. After all, anyone can cover 135 miles in 24 hours, eh? Past their fortieth birthday? Sure, but it is not 'real' running.

They are two people who run in a different venue than what almost all of the letsrun community has any knowledge of--ultras or trails. Maybe that is what draws so much hatred: what gives birth to so many statements born of ignorance. So few on this forum have any idea of what Reed or Karnazes are doing that they just can't relate and aren't going to take the time to learn. Ignorance based hate is much easier.

What they do is related to running in the same way running a marathon is related to running the 110 meter high hurdles. There just is no standard for comparison.

And John Geesler covered the 300-mile part in under 72 hours some months back, just wasn't nonstop, wasn't 'real' running, wasn't...

I hate Dean Karnazes because he is better looking than me.

Out.

Not after he takes off his sunglasses. Didn't you see the 60 minutes piece? Woof!!

And the name Ann Trason means nothing to you? Hate to break it to you but she accomplished a lot in the ultra world. How quickly we all forget that there is talent out there.

I don't watch TV. I just saw his "rugged" picture on the book jacket.

Ladies and fags, is Karnazes a hunk?

Out.

In his own mind.

let me put it this way: someone getting famous for writing a 30,000 page novel shouldn't be considered a "real" author, should they?

i see your ultra scorn and raise you the olympics. the nastiness on here directed at paula radcliffe was incredible - no doubt ALL of which was from males slower than her.

I would venture there are very few "real" runners on this site any longer. Just a bunch of wannabe kids, weird old age groupers, interlopers, and cyber-bullies. Sometimes, one of these fine "athletes" makes the mistake of leaving a trail or real e-mail address and Mr. World Class Badass turns out to be a 17 year old JV scrub with a lifetime 5K PR of 19:30. (Isn't Google great?)

I respect what Karnazes and Reed do just as I respect Bekele, Ritz, or a housewife from "Team-in-Training". They all run with a purpose, goals, and they seem to enjoy what they do. I suspect many of the haters here are not committed to sport but just enjoy running their mouths in a consequence free environment. I also tend to think that their attitudes towards different approaches to running (ultras, charity, just for fun) probably also matches the way they feel about women, minorities, and immigrants in the real world - hateful, hurtful, and woefully ignorant. Sadly, these jerks only further marginalize a niche sport fighting for any modicum of respect from the larger public.

Do what you love, love what you do, respect the pursuits of others. Why is that so hard for some?

Kilgore wrote:

I don't watch TV. I just saw his "rugged" picture on the book jacket.

Ladies and fags, is Karnazes a hunk?

Out.

there's one hyphenated word for that: air-brush

one does not have to be a guy and a fag to judge his looks. he looks like a high school geek grown up. he's not ugly, but certainly not handsome.

Deena Kastor said she wants to try Ultras some day. I can't wait to hate that bitch! but it will have to wait until she's no longer a 'real runner.' Damn...

Lurkalot--

If I was the moderator, this would be on the front page tomorrow.

Hilarious, but true.

ante bellum wrote:

i see your ultra scorn and raise you the olympics. the nastiness on here directed at paula radcliffe was incredible

oh lay me down

by the side of the road

by the side of the road

where i weep

once upon a time in

the olympics i thought

i would run

but that curb just looked too good to me

Kilgore wrote:

I don't watch TV. I just saw his "rugged" picture on the book jacket.

Ladies and fags, is Karnazes a hunk?

Out.

Kilgore,

I am neither. But, having seen Dean in person maybe a half dozen times, I'd say he is a good looking man.

While we have never met, old friend, I'm sure you are correct in suspecting that he is out of your league.

That was brilliant commentary, Sir Lurkalot.

Excellent thread. I will admit the bashing on this board is so mean, full of ignorance and self-loathing that I can not believe that people really feel the way they do. I am taking a break from letsrun for a while. I need to be around more positive people!

Erbli,

If you are a big fan of people who engage in excessive self-promotion and flat out lying (eg, "i have run more miles than anyone on the planet"), then you must be a big fan of toby.

I agree that this bashing has gone WAY overboard. In fact it should have never have begun at all. I am an ultrarunner on Team Montrail/Patagonia and run as many ultras as I can. Why because I am decent at it, I love it, and I understand it. To me, since I dont race at distances such as the mile and 5k, I dont really understand these events. Because of that, to me it seems anyone could "hang tough" for 4 to 16 minutes given that I am used to events that take 5 to 30 hours. However I know that these short events require a greatdeal of commitment and hardwork to excel at. What I dont do however is look down on these racers at the short distances. What I am saying, is that instead of judging people by how far they run, how much walking is involved at longer distances, and how much media coverage they get, we should judge people by the devotion to the sport and more importantly, what type of sportsmen they are. I agree that alot of this negativity has been fostered by bored teenagers who have nothing better to do than lambast something they know nothing about. As for all of the personal attacks on both Dean and Pam as individuals, grow up. I know both of they and they are decent people. Lets write about more useful and interesting things.

I would venture that you cannot consider a sub-2H40 marathoner a real runner. Sub 2H25, more like...