800m Specific Workouts

This is so comical it does not warrant the effort to point out your glaring flaws.

Why not read a book about middle distance running then you will see what's missing

I sure hope you're doing some longer intervals in there too. I noted that you said you'd be doing these workouts once a week, so obviously it would be supplemented by longer workouts and some mileage.

I think the workouts will only be hard based on how well you pace them. They're obviously not all out efforts. Make sure they're well integrated into a week however. And also, throw in some gear change / distance change workouts. Ladders or surge-based workouts do a lot of good.

The 100m workouts seem fine for the most part, but maybe have a single session of 100's with 90-120s rest per rep, but a lot of reps and no sets. Also, for the interval workouts you have between 100 and 300m, jack up the rep rest by about 30 seconds. Otherwise you'll really be hurting and won't get great benefits. Because speed endurance seems to be apparent in most of your workouts. Beyond that the setup seems pretty good. Here are some workouts that include speed endurance and some actual speed.

9 x 200 @ 800 Date Pace w/ 400j

6 x 300m @ 100% w/ 8 mins rest

12 x 300m @ 45s w/ 60s rest --> if you run >45s, drop to 200s. Once you run > 30s, drop to 100s.

10 x 30-30 w/ 2 min rest --> a 30-30 is a 30 second 200 followed by 30 seconds of rest followed by a 30 second 200

20 x 200 --> should be run in 20 minutes. After you run the 200, the remainder of the minute is your rest.

8 x 400 w/ 60s rest at Mile Pace

3 x 6-4-2-4-6 --> 800 Goal Pace w/ 3 mins rest, 5 mins set rest

Thanks! That's a lot of help... one thing, when you say jack up the rests by 30s, do you mean only for the 200s, or for the 100s, 200s and 300s?

And yes, I have 800-1600 reps at 5k-10k pace workouts, faster than 800m pace workouts, tempo runs and more mileage, this isn't only a very narrow part of ny training... for the workouts you wrote down, the 3x 6-4-2-4-6 looks impossible and 20x200 looks horrible, but I'll give the rest of them a try... I'll edit the workouts to try and include change of pace / ladders.

I'm by no means an expert at this, but I did read a few middle distance training books. Perhaps I severely misunderstood the part you claim is missing from these workouts. Could you please be of assistance and point me in the right direction to enlighten myself? Thanks a lot. :)

The last 6 workouts (starting with 2x2x400 2:15 reps, 9' sets and ending with 4 x 500 5' reps) are very tough if you are doing them at 800 race pace.

I heard that Christian Brothers Academy (upstate NY) used to do something similar in the early to mid 1970s. Anyone who ran there during that time or knows the program who can comment?

What about a hour run, most Kenyan 800m runners I know of spend a couple months doing a long slow base about this time of the year. The evidence I have heard over the years from elites is that you start over distance and slowly cut down to under distance for sharpening. I never understood this sets of reps nonsense, either do 10 x 200 or don't, 2 x 5 x 200m is unneeded rubbish.

the purpose of sets and reps is to take you to the next level of fitness. By halving your usual recovery in a 10x200 type workout between reps and doubling between reps, you are subjecting yourself to higher stresses (which you may or may not want). It's very much a preference thing, but that's the argument behind it.

Also, i do long endurance runs, that just isn't the focus of this thread, the 800m pace workouts are a small sliver of a comprehensive training regime, but one i am unsure about. :)

Hey just give me my monthly supply of lsd and stop messing around

Alright did the 4x5x100 today and I averaged 15.2. You're right though the rest between sets will have to be longer when the workouts get harder.

Was wondering are you targeting a 800 meter race? I mean is the 800 the event your going to run? Your looking at 6 months of the workouts and was wondering if you have short term targets to see how your 800 is and how you feel doing it. A suggestion I would have, is maybe early on, instead of focusing on say 1 minute rests....maybe start with beats per minute count. So maybe you want to be at 118 bpm before you go. There is that Lucas Verzbicus (sp) video on WOW I think were he is doing like 7x400. His mom/coach wants him at 120 bpm before he goes. Early season I like to start with BPM recovery to make sure the runner is fine, I learn things about his recovery, I can record and compare down the road etc.

As someone said you should increase the recoveries, and I would suggest jogging rec.

You have very demanding sessions coming in the last 8 weeks, and some of the 300´s aren´t that easy either. I think you should drop the 500´s completely. You have to have very good aerobic and anaerobic capacities to be able to benefit from those. I believe that you will be ready to race after the 400´s. I also suggest to keep a ~10 day period consisting plenty of easy and some moderate running (no high lactates during this period) after you´ve finished the 400´s sessions, to maintain/refresh the basic endurance.

keepsimple11 wrote:

Was wondering are you targeting a 800 meter race? I mean is the 800 the event your going to run? Your looking at 6 months of the workouts and was wondering if you have short term targets to see how your 800 is and how you feel doing it. A suggestion I would have, is maybe early on, instead of focusing on say 1 minute rests....maybe start with beats per minute count. So maybe you want to be at 118 bpm before you go. There is that Lucas Verzbicus (sp) video on WOW I think were he is doing like 7x400. His mom/coach wants him at 120 bpm before he goes. Early season I like to start with BPM recovery to make sure the runner is fine, I learn things about his recovery, I can record and compare down the road etc.

Yes, I am targeting my sectional meet in mid may... That sounds like a great idea for the early season to make sure I'm not going too hard. Thanks for the advice!

Ok, since the 500s take place in the competition phase when there is 4 consecutive weeks of racing (league/ sections trials/finals), you think the 800 race can replace those sessions just fine? I've been glued to the 500 mentality because of my coach but it's almost impossible to hit goal pace for more than 1 rep, maybe it's time to move away from them. Would the 10 day period be like 10k pace and slower only? What you're saying makes sense though to kind of taper before the hard competition phase. Thanks for your help!

winterthruspring wrote:

Ok, since the 500s take place in the competition phase when there is 4 consecutive weeks of racing (league/ sections trials/finals), you think the 800 race can replace those sessions just fine? I've been glued to the 500 mentality because of my coach but it's almost impossible to hit goal pace for more than 1 rep, maybe it's time to move away from them. Would the 10 day period be like 10k pace and slower only? What you're saying makes sense though to kind of taper before the hard competition phase. Thanks for your help!

Exactly, racing will replace the 500´s. Even doing 400m repetitions @ 800m pace is very demanding, and if using anything longer, I suggest time trials, ladders, or if doing 500m (or 600m) reps use as long recoveries as it takes to finish the session without digging too deep, and keep the overall volume well under 2k. If something feels almost (or is) impossible to do, it probably takes too much out of you, mentally and physically. Keep in mind that you don´t want to be at your peak fitness during the pre-season, or in the first race(s) of the season.

Yes, the 10 day period could include an "easy" 10k pace / tempo workout but nothing faster, except strides/short sprints. I also suggest to do some moderate, sub-lactate threshold running during the "recharging" period.