NY Times says Lauren Fleshman is the "best American distance runner never to make an Olympic team"

Dave Patrick. Look it up.

lmb wrote:

Dave Patrick. Look it up.

Excellent choice. A very frustrating case.

speaking of 800m wrote:

on a side note, did you know that Gabe Jennings ran a 1:46 800m?!

Jennings 1:46 aligns with his 3:35 and his general style and a mid-d specialist. Nothing extraordinary for someone at that level (young Centro, young Manzano, Lukezic, Stember, Lomong)

I see the men's list as:

Solinsky

Krumm

Nenow

Lindsay

Beardsley

Falcon

True

800 dude wrote:

Mark Nenow

David Krummenacker

I don't think there are any marathoners other than Khannouchi. We have so few truly world class marathoners, that they all usually make the team. Maybe Beardsley or Greg Meyer?

Provisionally on the list: Ben True (the only faster non-Olympian is Solinski.)

No one can touch Nenow on the Men's side if you look at longevity, world/US rankings and not making the Team.

The article says "most likely" right before the never made Olympic team part".

bfullem wrote:

I would argue that Lisa Rainsberger was a far better runner than Fleshman based on her Boston Marathon win and 4th in the Olympic trials 3 times. And she missed the Olympics in the pool by 1 spot as well.

http://www.runnersworld.com/tag/lisa-larsen-rainsberger

Rainsberger won Boston in a very diluted field. Other marathons were offering money and Boston did not. Look at the winning time it is about 10 min slower than previous years or years after. But, hey she has won it.

As for the 4th places (and 3rd in swimming), that is pretty darn amazing.

Gil Dodds

NCAA Men's Cross Country Champion (1940)

Three-time US (AAU) champion in the mile 1942, 1944, and 1947.

American record in the mile (1943)

Twice set the world indoor record for the mile in one year (1944)

synthpop wrote:

speaking of 800m wrote:

on a side note, did you know that Gabe Jennings ran a 1:46 800m?!

Jennings 1:46 aligns with his 3:35 and his general style and a mid-d specialist. Nothing extraordinary for someone at that level (young Centro, young Manzano, Lukezic, Stember, Lomong)

I see the men's list as:

Solinsky

Krumm

Nenow

Lindsay

Beardsley

Falcon

True

Mark Curp held the half WR for 5 years, and the AR for 22 years. Also the last American male ever to win Falmouth.

On air personality wrote:

synthpop wrote:

Jennings 1:46 aligns with his 3:35 and his general style and a mid-d specialist. Nothing extraordinary for someone at that level (young Centro, young Manzano, Lukezic, Stember, Lomong)

I see the men's list as:

Solinsky

Krumm

Nenow

Lindsay

Beardsley

Falcon

True

Mark Curp held the half WR for 5 years, and the AR for 22 years. Also the last American male ever to win Falmouth.

I realize road racing was bigger back then, but did Curp or Lindsay ever show "Olympic" potential on the track or in the marathon?

It's a tough call, but I would put Krumm, Falcon, and Nenow all ahead of Solinsky. Or I'd call all 4 a toss up. But, then again, I probably missing someone else worthy of consideration.

Nice thread, by the way.

Yippee wrote:

Surely Joe LeMay could sneak on the top 10 list?

2:13:55

28:23

Hahaha! That just grazy talk. Hey Joe, Why should you never-ever tell a Cow a secret?

I think this reporter is the same douche that savaged Lolo Jones.

NYT is racist.

Molly Ludlow based on how she has competed on the circuit after placing 4th the last two trials and her very recent 1:57 should not be overlooked. And she is less overexposed and much more likeable. Fleshman deserves the vitriol she gets. It comes with being a brand.

The Times did qualify the Olympic claim: "most likely being the best American distance runner never to make an Olympic team".

And women's and men's sports are completely different so I think they should be discussed differently and the argument can be made she's one of the best American distance runners to not make an Olympics on the women's side.

The Times didn't qualify what they started the article with, "Lauren Fleshman was the top collegiate distance runner in American history."

That is crazy. She didn't win NCAA cross and she doesn't have the most track titles. Maybe she has the most track titles by an American runner over 1500m? Is that the case? She won 4 individual titles (3 outdoor 5ks, one indoor 3k, and a DMR).

Then state that. Maybe that is the claim they are going off of?

It's weird because since a few recent women who had success at the NCAA level have really surpassed Fleshman as a pro so I wouldn't have thought of Fleshman as being in contention for the top American collegiate distance runner ever. Goucher and Flanagan were of her generation and won cross. Simpson in one year set the NCAA records in the mile, 3000 m, and 5000 m indoors, 1500 m, 3000 m steeplechase and 5000 m outdoors, according to wikipedia.

I think of them being another class of runner than Fleshman because of their pro success so that then clouds my viewing of her collegiate career. I guess one could argue if she hadn't gotten hurt she could have been as good as them or the argument could be turned around and be Fleshman won more with less talent than anyone.

But I think most of us would disagree with "Lauren Fleshman was the top collegiate distance runner in American history."

I believe by the standards of making the 1980 boycotted team as not ever making an Olympic team then I would say that Anthony Sandavol in the marathon that year should at least deserve some consideration.

Mark Belger

David Patrick is a good contribution.

Would Chuck Aragon be in the conversation for men?

After today, how about Keni Harrison for all women, not exclusively distance.

This board is so male dominant that there are several women that are ahead of Fleshman and this board is unaware of it,

I believe Patti Dillon (Catalono) once held a dozen AR and a few WR ranging from 8k to the marathon.

Anyone else done that?

"I realize road racing was bigger back then, but did Curp or Lindsay ever show "Olympic" potential on the track or in the marathon?

It's a tough call, but I would put Krumm, Falcon, and Nenow all ahead of Solinsky. Or I'd call all 4 a toss up. But, then again, I probably missing someone else worthy of consideration.

Nice thread, by the way."

---

Lindsay never ran a marathon. He was second in the 5k at the Pan Am Games and third in the 79 USA Outdoor Track 5k. Also was the 10k National champ in 79. For the most part he ran (and won) on the roads.

wejo wrote:

But I think most of us would disagree with "Lauren Fleshman was the top collegiate distance runner in American history."

+1