sub 3:10 marathon

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What's your current ability at shorter distances?

I'm a mid to high 18min 5k'er, 1:27ish half merry..... This winter i'm putting in 30-40mpw... Mostly speedwork on the mill.... When in marathon mode this summer gonna shoot for 50-60mpw..

Again 37/m i'm not a high school track star.. Keep in mind ;)... do I have what it takes?

Yes, in my opinion you should be able to run 3:10 or faster, especially based on your 1/2 marathon pr. The speedwork combined with long runs, at least 18 miles, should get you there. I've got a 2:40 marathon pr from many years ago, currently trying to break 3 hours as a 50 year old and it's not easy:):):) Good luck and don't quit trying as you can surely do it based on those times.

bqhopeful2015 wrote:

I'm a mid to high 18min 5k'er, 1:27ish half merry..... This winter i'm putting in 30-40mpw... Mostly speedwork on the mill.... When in marathon mode this summer gonna shoot for 50-60mpw..

Again 37/m i'm not a high school track star.. Keep in mind ;)... do I have what it takes?

I hear ya I had a train wreck of a marathon last yr I got a little cocky and went for sub 3 on my first marathon.. Everything was going great til about mile 14, hit a downpour, air got real heavy, and I missed sub 3, and my BQ all together Also developed ITBS for 4months...

So on one hand i'm a little hesitant about registering for another marathon.. Yet at the same time I know I can do better and would like to take another shot at a BQ...

Not sure what I could pull off full or half at the moment.. I ran a 39:26 10k on the treadmill the other day I know that doesn't count but when you live in Buffalo,NY you have limitations haha..

Sorry, but I'm one of those runners that "does believe" it counts. To me you still ran 10k in 39:26 and running on a treadmill is not easy. Honestly, I know many, many runners who say it's actually harder and believe it's worth more.

I live north of Detroit so the treadmill is my friend as well. Without it, I'd be in crappier shape than I am in now, that's for sure.

I'm currently not quite to your level, but I too do all of my speed work on the treadmill...1/2, 1/4, 1/4, 1/2 and another 1/4 this morning. I'm taking baby steps and just trying to stay healthy and ease into the harder stuff slowly but surely.

Right now it's working but who knows what tomorrow will bring. I will not even think about entering a marathon until I can get a half marathon in the 1:25 range which will give me a decent shot at breaking 3 hours.

Good luck with your quest:)!

p.s. I was decent but not a super stud. Regardless, when you get injured and miss a lot of time, it's a lot harder to bounce back when you hit 50, that I know:)

bqhopeful2015 wrote:

Ok so I wanna go sub 3:10 next fall in my marathon... Anyone know of any good training programs to get me in the 3:05-3:10 range to get entry.

Ok, so what plan did you use in your last marathon attempt? Any of the more common training plans?

I know a few people that had run several previous marathons using various plans that trained for the next one using the Hansons plan & book, and spoke very positively of their results. I've read the book & the plan looks solid to me. I think it will set you up to avoid many of the common traps that marathoners run into, especially on somewhat lower weekly mileage.

Pfitzinger's book & plan is also very popular amongst the 2:55-3:10 marathoners I know.

The principles laid out in Daniels' Running Formula are excellent. I'd be careful blindly following the plans - some of them, depending on which book edition & plan you choose can be quite challenging.

That's what comes to mind. Given your current situation, I'd suggest you check out the Hanson's Marathon Method (http://www.amazon.com/Hansons-Marathon-Method-Renegade-Fastest/dp/1934030856) or Pfitzinger's Advanced Marathoning (http://www.amazon.com/Advanced-Marathoning-2nd-Pete-Pfitzinger/dp/0736074600/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1424897816&sr=1-1&keywords=pfitzinger+marathon) and see which one appeals to you more, and seems like a better fit for what training you'd like to do.

Good luck!

PS, you absolutely have the abiltiy, as someone else said.

Also know that, especially for the marathon, overall mileage is a huge, huge factor in your ability to translate your shorter races (5k, 10k) to the marathon. This article was hugely eye-opening for me, and explains why people running relatively lower & middle mileage often overestimate their marathon fitness from the popular calculators. It also shows a no-brainer way for many of us to get faster - build that mileage up at a reasonable rate.

YES! You most definitely have what it takes to go sub 3:10, and if you train very smart I could see you actually going sub 3, if your HM time drops a couple minutes

bqhopeful2015 wrote:I'm a mid to high 18min 5k'er, 1:27ish half merry..... This winter i'm putting in 30-40mpw... Mostly speedwork on the mill.... When in marathon mode this summer gonna shoot for 50-60mpw..

Again 37/m i'm not a high school track star.. Keep in mind ;)... do I have what it takes?

FWIW not long after I started running I managed a hilly 1:27 HM the dead of winter, then a 3:10 marathon a few months later in May. I was in my early 30s at the time, so not much difference in age. I was also running about 40 miles a week.

Talking about moving from 30-40 mpw to 50-60 mpw is different than doing it, obviously. I'd get started on that sooner rather than later. Build up slowly. Even a measly 3 miles added per week will get you up there before the end of May. There's definite reward waiting for you if you manage a steady block of higher mileage for a significant time, even throwing in the odd double. Once I was running 60+ mph it wasn't long before I was in the 1:18-1:19 HM range, something that seemed not possible to me when I was running the mileage you are at now. It really makes a difference.

I actually used the Hal Higdon advanced marathon training approach.. I think what hurt me the most was wearing a New Balance Runner watch that wasn't accurately tracking my proper distance.. I went out and bought a Garmin Forerunner so I can have better tracking.

I think I will shoot for the 3:05-3:10 range... My number one goal is to run Boston, and possibly be done w/ the whole marathon thing.. We'll see how it goes..

I already was in half marathon shape before using Higdon's plan starting off at 17 then a more easy wk, then knock it up another mile til I was doing 20. I actually ran a mock solo marathon in 3:08 but again i'm not sure how accurate that was w/ the watch I was using..

I think on my next marathon i'll shoot for 7:10 pace and hold it for as long as possible...

What apporach would you take? how many mpw would you be running if you were me...

Easy weeks- I hear ya I usually am exhausted after a 50mpw after working full time , married 2 kids, house.. I usually like to get it done and over w/ first thing in the morning..

In a lot of books i've read they say don't go for a marathon trial before race day...... What would be a good way of getting a good idea of what kinda marathon shape i'm in ?

I did 11 miles at 7:03 pace on treadmill today felt fairly comfortable... not sure i could hold that another 15.2 or not....

bqhopeful2015 wrote:Easy weeks- I hear ya I usually am exhausted after a 50mpw after working full time , married 2 kids, house.. I usually like to get it done and over w/ first thing in the morning..

In a lot of books i've read they say don't go for a marathon trial before race day...... What would be a good way of getting a good idea of what kinda marathon shape i'm in ?

I did 11 miles at 7:03 pace on treadmill today felt fairly comfortable... not sure i could hold that another 15.2 or not....

Your last sentence is concerning, but nothing that can't be dealt with. Honestly, the two things that make me feel good about an upcoming marathon is:

1. Regular runs for over 2 hours, week after week, no lingering soreness. It's just another run.

2. Half marathons. Do two or three while logging the miles over a season. Just train through them. This may not work for you, but I felt the struggles I go though during a half are quite similar to what I experience in the middle 15 miles or so of a marathon.

Also married with 2 kids, house, and I'm 50. The better shape you get in the less you'll suffer. My fastest race was my easiest, believe it or not. Get the miles up, even if they're slow miles, it doesn't matter...get them in. 8.5mph on a treadmill for 11 miles is very good and something to build on. If you only want one shot at it and be done with the marathon, do it right or at least as right as possible. Miles are important. By the Spring I plan on being at least 55-60 mpw and I'm shooting for a fast half this fall, not a marathon like you (but as of today you are way ahead of me...meniscus surgery put me behind:(:( "If" I can accomplish that, then the marathon at sub 3 will be feasible. If you run a decent half, you'll know what you're capable of for a marathon, with proper training of course.Get more sleep, eat well, stretch, do what you can to be less tired in the morning. I know, it's not easy with two kids and mine are teenagers...but a lot of running around in between everything else. Breaking 3:10 should not be even an issue for you, it's getting to sub 3, if that's what you want, and then working hard to maintain 6:52ish pace.Good luck:)!

bqhopeful2015 wrote:

Easy weeks- I hear ya I usually am exhausted after a 50mpw after working full time , married 2 kids, house.. I usually like to get it done and over w/ first thing in the morning..

In a lot of books i've read they say don't go for a marathon trial before race day...... What would be a good way of getting a good idea of what kinda marathon shape i'm in ?

I did 11 miles at 7:03 pace on treadmill today felt fairly comfortable... not sure i could hold that another 15.2 or not....

Yea I just don't wanna make the same mistake twice and miss my BQ as well.. Thinkin i'll shoot for somewhere in the neighborhood of 3:05-3:10 for my qualifying race.. If I get into Boston maybe shoot for the sub 3.. Personally I think a BQ alone is "bragging rights" haha.. No male from my town has done it in over 20 yrs, yea I know i'm from a small town lol...

You think 50-60mpw for 3-4months will get me there? Long runs every weekend of at least 18? right? Do you train alone?

Thanks for the help.. Still not sure why i'm having so much trouble registering for the marathon.. Not sure if it's because of the injury I sustainted last time, the rigorous training, or it's just the crappy weather that has me in a rut.. Wouldn't mind droppin another 10-15lbs too..

I do 18, that's just me and what I'm comfortable with for fitness and personal confidence that I'll have no problem with the distance...works for me.I train alone, because that's the way it is...even though I'm in Michigan's running mecca:):):), Hanson Land:) Once in a while I hook up with someone, but rarely. I'm 50 and like you, busy, but I love to run and am trying every trick I can to break 3 hours in 1.5 to 2 years...sub 1:25 half first:) I agree on the weight thing. I'm not heavy, but would still like to get lighter as it does help. If you're around 60 mpw, I'd say you're good to go in my humble opinion anyways. Breaking 3:10 should be doable with proper pacing and at least average weather on a fair course. Good luck with the training and race!

bqhopeful2015 wrote:

Yea I just don't wanna make the same mistake twice and miss my BQ as well.. Thinkin i'll shoot for somewhere in the neighborhood of 3:05-3:10 for my qualifying race.. If I get into Boston maybe shoot for the sub 3.. Personally I think a BQ alone is "bragging rights" haha.. No male from my town has done it in over 20 yrs, yea I know i'm from a small town lol...

You think 50-60mpw for 3-4months will get me there? Long runs every weekend of at least 18? right? Do you train alone?

Thanks for the help.. Still not sure why i'm having so much trouble registering for the marathon.. Not sure if it's because of the injury I sustainted last time, the rigorous training, or it's just the crappy weather that has me in a rut.. Wouldn't mind droppin another 10-15lbs too..

Ok cool.good luck with your sub 3. Perhaps I'll give it another whirl eventually.... Where would u pace yourself if u were me inn the marathon..7:10ish... was thinkin of doin a half at end of apr to get a gauge of where I'm at...

dunno bout u but in sick of winter jus wanna get out there again.I've gone out a few times jus to dam cold...

bqhopeful2015 wrote:

1:27ish half merry..... Mostly speedwork on the mill....

Keep saving all that time with all the abbreviations and you will have the extra training time to hit 100mpw.

bqhopeful2015 wrote:

I'm a mid to high 18min 5k'er, 1:27ish half merry..... This winter i'm putting in 30-40mpw... Mostly speedwork on the mill.... When in marathon mode this summer gonna shoot for 50-60mpw..

Again 37/m i'm not a high school track star.. Keep in mind ;)... do I have what it takes?

I think that speedwork may come back to bite you. I'd be hitting the base-training now. Lower-speed running in order to get lower heart-rates for building capillaries. I know you want to get it over with fast with everything else on your plate, but if you're already on there for 77 minutes (referencing your ~7min/mile 11-mile), what's 82 to 87?

Finally, props for trying, you'll hit it. Glad to know I'm not the only one forcing myself onto the treadmill this winter. I'm from the snow-belt south of Rochester, so I know the pain of the winters in WNY.

Yea I know I think you're definitely right about the slowing it down part.. I'm normally a 5k'er so I have to make sure I don't get caught up in the hustle and bustle when the gun goes off like my last marathon.

I think this yr when i'm in marathon mode i'll shoot for long runs of at least 18 every weekend and not worry about pace on them.. Save the speedwork for a separate day, and hopefully everything will fall into place..

I'm fed up w/ the treadmill as well! Anything over 4miles gets old fast! So I definitely hear you there, but it does keep you in shape when you can't get outside...

What would you say is a good amount of training for a marathon? 3 to 4months? 50-60mpw?