Why do high school runners suck at pacing?

Inexperience - plain and simple. I made that mistake a couple times and paid dearly for it. As you move up a couple levels of competition, races become mind games instead of just seeing who pulls a prefontaine burnout

I thought i was the only other person who understood this man. Here's a story for you.. last year at regionals I was in last place by a good 10 meters for the first 200. This was a race that included about 60 people so there was really no reason to fight for positioning, yet everyone blazed the start. I eventually worked my way up through the pack nice and consistent and ended up 2nd place in 16:04. everyone from 6th place and back was 16:40+

Plain and simple 90% of high school runners dont know wtf theyre doing other than just running as hard as they can. be smart, keep doing what youre doing.

the typical HS mindset is go out fast and try to hang on. I remember my freshmen year I'd go out in like 630 and run high 21s most races and guys told me I should go out faster if I want to PR. They happened to be guys running mid 20s 5k going out in 550 pace. Which is plain stupid.

Fast forward to senior year, my 1st mile was my slowest mile of every race that year. I'd be dead last out of 56 at league preview at 800m, at the mile I'd be around 25th, by 2 miles I was 5th. I moved into 3rd at 800m to go but got passed with 200m to go to finish 4th in under 17.

Pacing correctly takes you to a whole other level. Learning to pace probably took at least half a minute off my 5k.

Because they like to compete. If you want to run a time trial, you can do that at home. Stay in front with the leaders and race like a man.

"way too fast"

Even among older runners, many will start off at a pace they cannot sustain through the race. Some like to run positive splits, while others like to ease into the race and run fast at the end (negative splits).

a couple of reasons:

1. Inexperience

2. Enthusiasm - they're ready to go and feel good/nervous at the start and there's too much energy to contain it to a 6 per mile or slower pace

3. Intent - some runners (and coaches) know runners who start relatively fast will fight like crazy to hang with whoever they are tailing at the midpoint. They might fail but they're in it and have a shot. If they go out slow they never see these runners and never strive to stay with them and net out running slower albeit more even.

By the way, kind of along the lines of #3 I actually support running a little faster than you think you can average. This is the way that young runners reach new heights. If you always go out at a controlled pace, you'll probably not improve much but the guy who is a bit aggressive/ambitious might fail the first 2 or 3 times but maybe the 4th time with fitness improving keeps it up and smashes a PR that a more conservative pacer never threatens.

You forgot coaching, or lack of coaching.

I am so good at pacing y'all don't even kno.

It is often a collective insanity thing. Kids do not want to get stuck in the back of the pack, especially if the course ends up on trails that are not very wide. So, the top kids hammer it at the beginning to open a gap. The above average kids push it try to keep up and the average kids absolutely floor it for fear of getting blocked out. Everyone except for the top kids end up running horrifically bad positive splits.

One way to get better is to go out too fast in one race and see if you can hold that pace for longer the next time.

Sucky inexperience coaches who don't know how to teach runners to go out on pace,

The same reason that 90% of high schoolers are dumb as f*ck about 90% of everything.

Because they're stupid.

I won many many races in high school cause I didn't play that game. I waited for the point when everyone slowed down (about 2 min into an XC race), and then I took off and ran like mad. Worked like a charm, even at National level races (would move up through the field). I remember in track races my goal was to split the second and third laps of 1-2 mi races the same as the first lap. So I would intentionally be at the back of the pack on the first lap. Then I dropped it on the second lap and would ago everyone. Then another long surge on the 3rd lap. Takes confidence, and worked very well.

While there is some "stupidity" in it, I also think it's more admirable than the cautious way some adults approach their road races. Is it more stupid to go out at 5:15 for mile 1, 5:45 for mile 2, and then just die with a 6:45 in mile 3 vs. doing a nice even 6:00 for all three miles? 17:45 is still faster than 18:00. Sure I do know you don't optimize your time by running so fast early, I also suggest that the cautious adult runner is also sub-optimizing by running too slow early on.

Also, there's competitiveness that adults seem to lose to some extent. These kids want to beat everyone they know whether teammates or kids they know from other schools. Older people seem to be more comfortable with getting beaten. Maybe it's less stupid but also less admirable.

whatsmyname wrote:

While there is some "stupidity" in it, I also think it's more admirable than the cautious way some adults approach their road races. Is it more stupid to go out at 5:15 for mile 1, 5:45 for mile 2, and then just die with a 6:45 in mile 3 vs. doing a nice even 6:00 for all three miles? 17:45 is still faster than 18:00. Sure I do know you don't optimize your time by running so fast early, I also suggest that the cautious adult runner is also sub-optimizing by running too slow early on.

Also, there's competitiveness that adults seem to lose to some extent. These kids want to beat everyone they know whether teammates or kids they know from other schools. Older people seem to be more comfortable with getting beaten. Maybe it's less stupid but also less admirable.

If you can run a 5:15, 5:45, and die down to a 6:45 I'm willing to bet you can run at least a 5:45 split, not 6 like you're saying.

train smart race smarter wrote:

Because they're stupid.

I won many many races in high school cause I didn't play that game. I waited for the point when everyone slowed down (about 2 min into an XC race), and then I took off and ran like mad. Worked like a charm, even at National level races (would move up through the field). I remember in track races my goal was to split the second and third laps of 1-2 mi races the same as the first lap. So I would intentionally be at the back of the pack on the first lap. Then I dropped it on the second lap and would ago everyone. Then another long surge on the 3rd lap. Takes confidence, and worked very well.

How is that confidence? That's playing it safe. Confidence would be going out with the leaders not hanging in the back.

Because confidence is knowing you can be behind everyone and you're going to kick their asses.

I experience the same. When I run a 1500 I am most of the time in one lof the last place after 100 or 200 meter, but then I pick up a lot of people.

In some road races you can pick up 20% of the people that are in front of you halfway If you run an even race.

I once ran a 10k and some guy finished 2,5 minutes behind me after leading for the first km (I was in the front group too and became second at 1 minute behind the winner.

There is one big road race here and everybody starts really really fast (because of Kenyans that are also present?) At start I am at 4th line, in some position between 40 an 45 I guess. However, after 500m I am in 100th place. I finished around 50th place....

whatsmyname wrote:

By the way, kind of along the lines of #3 I actually support running a little faster than you think you can average. This is the way that young runners reach new heights. If you always go out at a controlled pace, you'll probably not improve much but the guy who is a bit aggressive/ambitious might fail the first 2 or 3 times but maybe the 4th time with fitness improving keeps it up and smashes a PR that a more conservative pacer never threatens.

Not necessarily. If you pace right you know your fitness, and you can judge your pace accordingly. If you want to break 17 you go out in 529-530. Then you hold pace and/or negative split. If you feel really good you might negative split by quite a bit for that breakthrough instead of going out hard and hanging on.

Typically, I think of it as "run pace, but surge in between when tactically beneficial, and kick when its time to kick." Surging is often overlooked and lacking at the HS level. When I learned to surge it took me to a whole other level. The problem though, is when most people surge they slow down to slower than race pace after the surge. Best way, is run pace and let someone else do the work, when they slow down you surge up to the next guy, when you sense him slow down you surge up to the next guy and so on. You don't want to stick on someone if they're slowing down.