Now, I wanted to pose a question that has been brought upon me in the new found "college search". What are the times needed to gain attention from Notre Dame, as a junior. I am talking from the 800-5000m(Legitimate Cross Country Course). Please do not give me the bull crap of that you have to run a combo of a 4:10 flat mile and a 9:15 flat two mile; I realize that is bull due to Ryan and Stephen Shay both on scholarship with significantly lower times as high school juniors.
Ehhh, not really. More like a 9:30 or below will give them interest. 4:20 and below for the 1600m.
They'll pretty much recruit anyone at 4:15, 9:20 or better their junior year. No guarantee of money, but they'll talk to you so long as your grades and test scores are good. They've had trouble recently getting recruits through admission unless they've got top test scores or top track times.
Good luck with the college search.
Alright thanks! I will take the ACT once more and I will really boost my extracurricular performance in other activities that will help me stand out from all of the other Catholic boys. Thanks for the encouragement.
Hey! I'm actually running at Notre Dame next year. If you email the coaches, they actually send you a document with high school times that they want for Walk-On, Partial Scholarships, and Significant Scholarships. I wasn't looking to run XC for ND, so I don't know what they want for the 5k time, but I do know that we have a couple of incoming guys from high school with mid-15 5k times. I'd say that if you're at 1:52, 4:10, or 9:10 for the 800, 1600, or 3200 respectively, you're in good shape. If you can get in to ND by yourself without the coaches getting you in, it makes it a lot easier, and you probably only need to run around 1:55, 4:20, or 9:20 to make it on the team.
If you haven't visited yet or don't have much experience with ND, VISIT. The visit is what sets Notre Dame apart from every other university in the nation. If you come to visit some time during the school year, I'd be happy to show you around campus or just say hi. Send me an email at
if you have any other questions. Go Irish!
Some good advice in this thread but to the OP, your assumptions about the Shays are off base.
1) Stephen went to MSU then BYU, not ND. Nathan went to ND but probably not on scholarship.
2) Ryan did have modest HS times, but that was 15+ years ago (HS runners are much faster now) and he was a small school guy from northern MI who was clearly capable of major improvement.
The Shays all ran a bunch of AAU and USATF competitions, so although they might not have had the quickest times, they had a bunch of accolades from placing well in championship races, which is another way to draw attention from schools.
They also did a bunch of 10k road races in high school to show they could handle the collegiate racing distances.
Plus I think both of them (Ryan and Nathan) were valedictorians in high school so I'm sure that helped.
At ND there were a handful of guys that trained with the team but didn't make it into races. If you're at 9:45 for 2 mile or 4:30 for the mile you can probably walk on and if you improve, eventually compete. Not sure how much help you'll get with the admissions process with those times, but if you can get in on your own you could probably at least train with the team.
stephan didn't go to notre dame
It depends what you mean by " gain attention." If you want a full scholarship you have to be in the
As of this year, per discussion w/coach, standards are:
Distance Partial Walk On
1600m 4:10 4:20
3200m 9:10 9:20
They seem to be accurate, unlike some other programs I've seen.
The long time coach just announced his retirement, but I doubt they'd have much impact on walk on standards.
Agree with earlier posters advice. If you plan to walk on, make sure you get in first! Then, hit the above times. Easy!
A runner from a school near me was recruited to Notre Dame only a few years ago. He was smart like the others have suggested. His times in Junior year:
16:30 5k
4:19 Mile
1:52 800 (next closest time was like 2-3 seconds away or something)
This kid was recruited to run at Notre Dame, and he managed to improve some of his times a second or two senior year near the very end of outdoor track. He did often have some "bad" races, including a 1:57-8 at the state meet. But yeah,you have to be pretty good to secure a spot at ND.
I really do not know what a real 800m would be for me since I never run it in the big races; but I split 51's in the 4 x 400m relay all the time. Also I can pump off 9:20's in the 3200m. So now it is all about getting higher in the 30's on that dang test.
the mitten wrote:
Some good advice in this thread but to the OP, your assumptions about the Shays are off base.
1) Stephen went to MSU then BYU, not ND. Nathan went to ND but probably not on scholarship.
2) Ryan did have modest HS times, but that was 15+ years ago (HS runners are much faster now) and he was a small school guy from northern MI who was clearly capable of major improvement.
Yeah sorry about that mix up. I was kind of "off-kilter" and should have re-read what I had previously typed.
If a kid ran a 4:12 1600m and had a modest 27 on the ACT would he have a shot in gaining admissions?
Here's an idea: email the coach and ask if your current times are on track. He'll read the email at least... If you're not on track, you won't get one back.
Saints Go Marching wrote:
Here's an idea: email the coach and ask if your current times are on track. He'll read the email at least... If you're not on track, you won't get one back.
I think Fu Manchu was posing more of an admissions style question...?
Heck yes! If an athlete even wants to run anywhere they must call or email first!
runner dad with advice wrote:
As of this year, per discussion w/coach, standards are:
Distance Partial Walk On
1600m 4:10 4:20
3200m 9:10 9:20
They seem to be accurate, unlike some other programs I've seen.
The long time coach just announced his retirement, but I doubt they'd have much impact on walk on standards.
Agree with earlier posters advice. If you plan to walk on, make sure you get in first! Then, hit the above times. Easy!
Are these standards for real? How come they only have 2 guys that can break 25:00 for 8k?
if past weekend is any indication of direction of either genders cross country program, I would say they'll never return to the NCAA XC Championships either gender.
Sparks < Connelly/Piane wrote:
if past weekend is any indication of direction of either genders cross country program, I would say they'll never return to the NCAA XC Championships either gender.
I laughed during the flotrack WOW a few weeks ago when Sparks said they're not going to nationals just to be spectators. Think he ran on about six syllables too long.