David Epstein Says Tyson Gay Has Implicated Jon Drummond in Helping Him Dope

New
  • wejo
    cofounder
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:08pm CDT
    Forum Index
    David Epstein or ProPublica formerly of Sports Illustrated has an article out today that links Jon Drummond, chair of the USATF athletes advisory committee, to Tyson Gay's doping.

    Quote on Drummond:
    "According to people familiar with the Gay investigation, the sprinter told investigators that his former coach Jon Drummond, a gold medalist and chair of USA Track and Field's Athletes Advisory Committee, encouraged his use of the banned products and transported them for him"

    Worth a read here: http://www.propublica.org/article/weak-sanction-for-sprinter-gay-signals-change-in-anti-doping-tactics

    The article also explains why many (including LRC) believe it is essential to give reduced bans to athletes who cooperate with USADA and help out others cheats presumably like Tyson Gay did. As David said in an email to LRC this week, "It should be clear to all now that sophisticated dopers can beat testing". Thus its important for USADA to get the cooperation of athletes like Gay to catch coaches and other athletes who are cheating.
  • joho
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:16pm CDT
    re: wejo
    Forum Index
    Wow. This is going to get good.
  • MIC ITW
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:23pm CDT
    re: wejo
    Forum Index
    wejo wrote:

    Thus its important for USADA to get the cooperation of athletes like Gay to catch coaches and other athletes who are cheating.

    ...coaches, athletes, and the USATF athletes advisory chair who may be cheating.

    Sophisticated dopers can beat testing, especially when people on the inside are helping them, allegedly.
  • Moe's Tavern
    registered
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:32pm CDT
    re: wejo
    Forum Index
    Did he just compare t&f with orgnized crime?
  • Gomer
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:32pm CDT
    re: MIC ITW
    Forum Index
    I was in Paris at Le Stade de France for World's when Jon Drummond refused to leave the track after a dq. It went on for maybe 10 minutes.

    I've never seen anything quite like it. I would be like a pitcher getting dq'e for spitballing, and stubborning sitting on the mound for ten minutes as 55,421 fans jeered and cheered.

    Since the French don't have any Cossacks to enforce the rule of law, they just had to ask him in increasingly raised voice to "Sortez!".
  • guess i'm missed that part
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:38pm CDT
    re: wejo
    Forum Index
    I thought his claim was that he "unknowingly" took PEDs. Now he's saying that he did know he was taking them, and Drummond was his supplier? This should be good.
  • joho
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:41pm CDT
    re: Moe's Tavern
    Forum Index
    Moe's Tavern wrote:

    Did he just compare t&f with orgnized crime?


    No. He compared fighting doping in T&F to fighting the mafia by giving reduced sentences to informants.
  • Er...
    registered
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:42pm CDT
    re: guess i'm missed that part
    Forum Index
    Are you really unable to comprehend how he can claim both "unknowingly taking PEDs" AND that Drummond was facilitating their use?

    guess i'm missed that part wrote:

    I thought his claim was that he "unknowingly" took PEDs. Now he's saying that he did know he was taking them, and Drummond was his supplier? This should be good.
  • 26mi235
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:46pm CDT
    re: Gomer
    Forum Index
    The problem with using this as a negative is that Drummond was right [he did not jump the gun and the starter would not look at the data]. He knew that he had no chance one he left the track.

    Gomer wrote:

    I was in Paris at Le Stade de France for World's when Jon Drummond refused to leave the track after a dq. It went on for maybe 10 minutes.

    I've never seen anything quite like it. I would be like a pitcher getting dq'e for spitballing, and stubborning sitting on the mound for ten minutes as 55,421 fans jeered and cheered.

    Since the French don't have any Cossacks to enforce the rule of law, they just had to ask him in increasingly raised voice to "Sortez!".
  • False Negatives rule
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 1:52pm CDT
    re: wejo
    Forum Index
    As Paul Scott, head of Scott Analytics, which provides testing services to pro cycling teams, put it: "Anti-doping testing has a reputation that far exceeds its capabilities...The rate of false negatives is enormous."


    WEJO, the quote by Paul Scott should be the QOTD.

    This is one of the things that bothers people about NOP's in house testing lab. They can replicate the tests and find out which athletes have the right genes to beat WADA tests 100% of the time.

    There is no other reason to have an in-house testing lab unless you are actively trying to beat the system.
  • Look More Closelerly
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 2:15pm CDT
    Forum Index
    Xfit_guy_the_real_1 wrote:

    Ratting out American heroes like Drummond is disgusting. I wish he kept his mouth shut and sucked up his ban.

    Anyway, glad he is cleared and ready to compete this summer so we can focus on BIG athletes rather than SCRAWNY kenyans doing laps around the track, lol.

    Drummond a hero? Really?!?! Especially if what is being relayed about him is true? He ran some good lead off legs on 4x1s and had some fast 100s but seriously a hero? What did he do that was heroic?

    Somebody call up The Rock and get Drummond on season 2 of The Hero so we can see what he's made of.
  • Sonny Corleone
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 2:17pm CDT
    re: joho
    Forum Index
    joho wrote:

    Moe's Tavern wrote:

    Did he just compare t&f with orgnized crime?


    No. He compared fighting doping in T&F to fighting the mafia by giving reduced sentences to informants.


    Since when is the mafia not organized crime?
  • 96 Oly
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 2:22pm CDT
    re: Gomer
    Forum Index
    Gomer wrote:

    I was in Paris at Le Stade de France for World's when Jon Drummond refused to leave the track after a dq. It went on for maybe 10 minutes.

    I've never seen anything quite like it. I would be like a pitcher getting dq'e for spitballing, and stubborning sitting on the mound for ten minutes as 55,421 fans jeered and cheered.

    Since the French don't have any Cossacks to enforce the rule of law, they just had to ask him in increasingly raised voice to "Sortez!".

    Atlanta 100 meter final. Quite an impressive display of I am
    not leaving by Christie.
  • agip
    registered
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 2:28pm CDT
    re: 96 Oly
    Forum Index
    that list of ways to beat testing is incredibly depressing. I've already stopped watching pro sprinting and throws - do I have to give up distance too?
  • guess i missed that part
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 2:59pm CDT
    re: Er...
    Forum Index
    Er... wrote:

    Are you really unable to comprehend how he can claim both "unknowingly taking PEDs" AND that Drummond was facilitating their use?

    guess i'm missed that part wrote:

    I thought his claim was that he "unknowingly" took PEDs. Now he's saying that he did know he was taking them, and Drummond was his supplier? This should be good.




    Considering we JUST learned about the Drummond fact today, yes. I wish I could see the future like you.
  • straight
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 3:22pm CDT
    re: wejo
    Forum Index
    This has been happenings since the 60's and all the soveit "misinformation" about their training. Its just odd as if people pretend this doesnt happen. There is no way this problem can be solved without legalizing PED's where one Jon Drummond goes down 50 more rise in prominence.
  • piga
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 3:28pm CDT
    re: agip
    Forum Index
    agip wrote: do I have to give up distance too?

    yessum
  • Gomer
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 3:30pm CDT
    re: 26mi235
    Forum Index
    [quote]26mi235 wrote:

    The problem with using this as a negative is that Drummond was right [he did not jump the gun and the starter would not look at the data]. He knew that he had no chance one he left the track.

    I actually think he was in the right. I just cited it as a distinct memory of this prominent chap.
  • Forrrest Grump
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 3:36pm CDT
    re: Sonny Corleone
    Forum Index
    Sonny Corleone wrote:

    joho wrote:

    Moe's Tavern wrote:

    Did he just compare t&f with orgnized crime?


    No. He compared fighting doping in T&F to fighting the mafia by giving reduced sentences to informants.


    Since when is the mafia not organized crime?




    Are you stvpid or something?

    He wasn't comparing T&F to the mafia/organized crime.

    He was comparing methods of fighting doping to the methods used to fight mafia/organized crime by using reduced sentences to encourage people to give information on other dopers/criminals.

    When did schools quit teaching reading and critical thinking?
  • Er...
    registered
    5 years ago 05/08/2014 4:10pm CDT
    re: guess i missed that part
    Forum Index
    I'll try this for you again. Gay's claim is that he thought the substance he was using, which Drummond carried and encouraged him to use, was legal. He admits to doping, but says he did so unknowingly.

    So without anyone being able to see into the future, including me, Gay can indeed claim that

    A. He doped unknowingly

    B. Drummond encouraged/facilitated it.

    since in retrospect, he realizes the significance of Drummond carrying the stuff and encouraging him to use it.

    guess i missed that part wrote:

    [quote]Er... wrote:

    Are you really unable to comprehend how he can claim both "unknowingly taking PEDs" AND that Drummond was facilitating their use?

    >>
    Considering we JUST learned about the Drummond fact today, yes. I wish I could see the future like you.