A Serious Discussion of Training in Racing Flats

One mistake I have observed is people use flat for racing and speedwork but they are afraid to do longer runs for fear of beating up the legs. Then on marathon day they wonder why their legs don't feel good at mp. Specificity. Spend time training at your race pace in the shoe you intend to wear in the race. That means some long tempos in flats.

I have had mixed experiences in the past. Long stretches of no issues at all, with only 2 injuries, but both of which knocked me out for a significant amount of time. I have never trained in an official minimal shoe, just whatever racing flat I could get on sale. Over the years, this has been the adios, lunaracer, streak xc, adios 2, and rocket. I will say that I definitely feel stronger when doing my training in flats. But I also feel as if I need to do significantly more extra strengthening to prevent any sort of injury.

what if you argue that youd be a little better off racing if you ONLY race in race flats but train in heavier training shoes, meaning the flats will feel light on race day

exercise fizzzz wrote:

what if you argue that youd be a little better off racing if you ONLY race in race flats but train in heavier training shoes, meaning the flats will feel light on race day

For many years, this was my philosophy. I did 100% of my training in traditional trainers. However, I now believe (and I could be just as wrong now) that any benefit from switching to flats from trainers for a race is just mental. Not saying that there is not a performance increase from a weight decrease, but that the "I'm used to running with 12 oz on my feet, now I only have 7 oz! Now I can run so much faster!" attitude is likely mostly mental.

I also feel that, regardless of if the majority of your training is done in flats, all workouts should be. A race should not be a foreign feeling for your body. The warm-up should be the exact same as every workout. The shoes, shorts, and singlet should all be familiar (the shorts and singlet slightly less important than the shoes). Point being, whatever mental boost you get from putting on lighter shoes that you've never trained in can easily be offset by being comfortable in said shoes after having trained in them. The only question in my mind then, is how much. All runs???

I think you have to take all the "injury free since minimalism" stuff with a grain of salt. I mean, if guys with the best form in the world still get hurt while running barefoot in Africa, minimalism isn't going to be a panacea. In my experience, minimalist shoes change WHERE rather than how often I get hurt. They're also a bad choice for really technical trails.

Minimalism pros/cons:

Pro:

Fewer/no IT band injuries

changed to more of a midfoot strike

My feet don't hurt in long races

Fewer ankle sprains

Cons:

My calves are more likely to get sore,

Mild calf tear that was probably from working out in flats in mud

A couple of stone bruises from wearing flats on trails.

thats a great point, Ill take that into consideration, Im training for halves/10ks and 5ks right now, maybe Ill try some stuff in my flats then

I've been thinking about permanently switching to flats for everything. I've been besieged by bumps/aches/niggles over the last 6 months and I really seem to feel more comfortable in my flats than anything (NB1400, NB1600). I would be very curious to hear some input from people who have trained in flats for years to help me completely make up my mind.

Ho Hum wrote:

Cons:

My calves are more likely to get sore,

Mild calf tear that was probably from working out in flats in mud

A couple of stone bruises from wearing flats on trails.

First off, I couldn't agree more that there is no "cure-all" for running injuries. That said, if wearing a large foam block under your foot is CAUSING many of the injuries, then a change would help.

RE: my calves are more likely to get sore

Isn't that only during the initial transition phase? After that shouldn't the issue go away once you adjust? I can't imagine you would stay permanently sore??

OP, you need to have decent mechanics not to get injured in flats. If you have decent mechanics (run light and efficiently) it will make you even better.

I did 50-60 mpw in Streak XCs for years. I was ~4:10-4:00 1500m later in HS and college. Majority of that mileage was on pavement. Everything on the track or grass was done in spikes.

I never understood running in heavy trainers then switching to flats to "feel fast" in a race. Ridiculous logic IMO, or at least less beneficial than what you gain from minimalism.

Minimize_ wrote:

OP, you need to have decent mechanics not to get injured in flats. If you have decent mechanics (run light and efficiently) it will make you even better.

I did 50-60 mpw in Streak XCs for years. I was ~4:10-4:00 1500m later in HS and college. Majority of that mileage was on pavement. Everything on the track or grass was done in spikes.

I never understood running in heavy trainers then switching to flats to "feel fast" in a race. Ridiculous logic IMO, or at least less beneficial than what you gain from minimalism.

Let's say for discussion purposes that I do (neutral, midfoot strike). Can you talk more about your transition to streak xc's? And/or your experience once you fully switched?

Once a Shoe Guy wrote:

Minimize_ wrote:

OP, you need to have decent mechanics not to get injured in flats. If you have decent mechanics (run light and efficiently) it will make you even better.

I did 50-60 mpw in Streak XCs for years. I was ~4:10-4:00 1500m later in HS and college. Majority of that mileage was on pavement. Everything on the track or grass was done in spikes.

I never understood running in heavy trainers then switching to flats to "feel fast" in a race. Ridiculous logic IMO, or at least less beneficial than what you gain from minimalism.

Let's say for discussion purposes that I do (neutral, midfoot strike). Can you talk more about your transition to streak xc's? And/or your experience once you fully switched?

I went from Pegasus in JH and early high school. Our programs place a very strong emphasis on form, strength, and flexibility drills. So as I progressed my speed was commensurate to my form efficiency. I was looking for an edge as a low-mileage/high-intensity runner and started to cycle in racing flats a few days a week for general training, fast and slow---always paying attention to the drills and rehab. The transformation to 100% flats took place over a winter between XC and track and I immediately noticed how much more comfortable I was at faster paces and I had considerable closing speed for the first time in my life.

For as much as I did the "extras," (drills, religious stretching, rehab) I still consider myself tremendously fortunate not to have gotten hurt. Things happen, you know.

thats why you dont put 700 miles on flats... or any shoes as far as im concerned

Low-heeled shoes will always put more stress on your calves. That's just the mechanical trade you are making when you lower the heel. Less stress on shin/knee, but more on calf/Achilles/forefoot.

Reggin Reggi wrote:

I bought some cheap flats last year and put almost 700 miles in them. They got a weird wear pattern that kind of threw off my gait a little bit. I got shin splints (my first injury in over 10 years), and ended up having a shitty winter. I'm just now getting back to where I was last fall.

It was a dumb thing to do.

So you decided to switch overnight? Then put 700 miles on them? Can't blame the flats or minimalism for that, which you appear to recognize.

Minimalism, owed to Born to Run, conflates two separate issues: drop and shoe weight/cushioning. I think minimizing drop is helpful because it moves contact a bit forward. I think the barefoot take on cushioning is ridiculous and dangerous for people hammering on roads. Let me know when you see an African in Vibrams. Most minimalists I see in the Dallas area are fat trendoids who possibly do CrossFit and pursue Paleo. Front pack guys wear racing shoes to race, as they have always done. But they wear shock absorbers for serious mileage. I wear Cadences, but have a rotation of shoes, for biomechanical diversity and thus injury avoidance.

Minimize_ wrote:

Reggin Reggi wrote:

I bought some cheap flats last year and put almost 700 miles in them. They got a weird wear pattern that kind of threw off my gait a little bit. I got shin splints (my first injury in over 10 years), and ended up having a shitty winter. I'm just now getting back to where I was last fall.

It was a dumb thing to do.

So you decided to switch overnight? Then put 700 miles on them? Can't blame the flats or minimalism for that, which you appear to recognize.

No, I've run in minimalist shoes for years. And I usually put plenty of miles in them without a problem. But flats tend to be less durable than other shoes, as I learned. Like I said, it was a stupid thing to do. Flats are great for running in, and you can usually find some cheap ones easily enough, but some kind of minimalist trainer would definitely be more suited to long term use. Or you could buy a new pair of flats every week to use for all of your running, I guess (or just use them for speed work and races, duh...).

Once a Shoe Guy wrote:

Ho Hum wrote:

Cons:

My calves are more likely to get sore,

Mild calf tear that was probably from working out in flats in mud

A couple of stone bruises from wearing flats on trails.

First off, I couldn't agree more that there is no "cure-all" for running injuries. That said, if wearing a large foam block under your foot is CAUSING many of the injuries, then a change would help.

RE: my calves are more likely to get sore

Isn't that only during the initial transition phase? After that shouldn't the issue go away once you adjust? I can't imagine you would stay permanently sore??

Your calves can be very sore in the transition phase, true. But I'm saying I get sore calves occasionally from certain workouts, whereas before it'd be sore quads. It's just a tradeoff, and one that you should be careful about if you've had calf/achilles issues.

The most important reason that racing flats or minimal shoes are superior to traditional shoes is the lower stack height. Traditional shoes are very high and even a person with a neutral gait may find they need some form of stabilization. In shoes with a lower stack height (say 20mm or less), the foot is so close to the ground that stability features are not as necessary.Personally, I have a overpronating left foot and a supinating right foot. I have never had serious injuries but I have had some hip abductor issues and occasional knee pain when running in traditional trainers, such as Mizuno Wave Riders.When running in more minimal shoes such as New Balance Minimus 730V2 or Nike Free 5.0 I have had two occasions where I have had to take a few days off for a sore soleus muscle but other than that, no injuries whatsoever.Sample size of one, I realize. Just my 2 cents.

runner who professes wrote:

Minimalism, owed to Born to Run, conflates two separate issues: drop and shoe weight/cushioning. I think minimizing drop is helpful because it moves contact a bit forward. I think the barefoot take on cushioning is ridiculous and dangerous for people hammering on roads. Let me know when you see an African in Vibrams. Most minimalists I see in the Dallas area are fat trendoids who possibly do CrossFit and pursue Paleo. Front pack guys wear racing shoes to race, as they have always done. But they wear shock absorbers for serious mileage. I wear Cadences, but have a rotation of shoes, for biomechanical diversity and thus injury avoidance.

Saucony has a great range of shoes with low drop but lots of cushioning.