Interesting comment by Nick Symmonds about David Rudisha after semifinal

wtf?

please explain.

He also said he'll be trying to get his speed down to low 46 for 400. With his 1500 m strength combined with this level of spped he might be able to go 1:42.6 or under

Rudisha in an 800 can split Symmonds' 400 PR.

stuff you like to pee out wrote:

wtf?

please explain.

rea lololololo's post just above for explanation

It's because Rudisha is an Elf and Symmonds a hobbit.

Gandalfthewhite wrote:

It's because Rudisha is an Elf and Symmonds a hobbit.

LOL - good one!

It means Symmonds thinks the only way to beat Rudisha is by being able to run with him the first lap. Yes, he can, but it means he is doomed: at his limit.

The best 800 runners are all about running a very fast opening 400 and hanging on the rest of the way. They have come to believe that trying to run negative splits will result in slower times, always. Don't know why that has become the belief, but it has.

One way of going about it wrote:

... They have come to believe that trying to run negative splits will result in slower times, always. Don't know why that has become the belief, but it has.

Don't know? Empirical data much?!

NHUI wrote:

Did you hear Nick Symmond's comment on TV after his semi final race about David Rudisha. He was taking about how he could improve and said something like "its problematic to stay up Rudisha when Rudisha can do a 48 second 1st lap and my pr for the 400 is 47:40." It just goes to show how gifted Rudisha is......

I like to think of Nick being a super talent but he's got limits and they are not Rudisha's.

Last year at the Olympics after the 1:42, Nick said he never imagined he'd run that fast. That surprised me.

stuff you like to pee out wrote:

wtf?

please explain.

NHUI wrote:

rea lololololo's post just above for explanation

But why is that comment interesting? He's just saying the obvious. Tony McQuay is faster than me at the 400m. How interesting.

I think Symmond's quote is very telling and shows why he races the way he does. He has absolutely no confidence when racing Africans. He stays at the back because he's afraid to push himself. He goes into every race thinking that he won't/can't win and that 3rd or 4th place is good enough.

That's why he'll never medal or be a champion on the world scene. He doesn't believe in himself.

With better racing tactics he could have broken the AR and won the bronze last year. He needs to grow a pair and try to match the Africans. I wish he'd just have one race where he goes out in a 49.xx and sees what happens.

Symmonds could have always run a 1:42, but his lack of confidence and stupid tactics hold him back. It's a shame really...

Dr. Know wrote:

One way of going about it wrote:

... They have come to believe that trying to run negative splits will result in slower times, always. Don't know why that has become the belief, but it has.

Don't know? Empirical data much?!

Yes, YOU should run an analysis. Please report back your findings, and based them on high-level championship races. Those are your parameters. Best of luck.

With Amos and Rudisha suffering from injuries I really think that Symmonds can medal this year. If he can replicate what he did in London last year I think he will go home with a medal.

Reaper wrote:

I think Symmond's quote is very telling and shows why he races the way he does. He has absolutely no confidence when racing Africans. He stays at the back because he's afraid to push himself. He goes into every race thinking that he won't/can't win and that 3rd or 4th place is good enough.

That's why he'll never medal or be a champion on the world scene. He doesn't believe in himself.

With better racing tactics he could have broken the AR and won the bronze last year. He needs to grow a pair and try to match the Africans. I wish he'd just have one race where he goes out in a 49.xx and sees what happens.

Symmonds could have always run a 1:42, but his lack of confidence and stupid tactics hold him back. It's a shame really...

So you think you know Symmonds' body better than Symmonds?

It's true that it's very hard to win if you don't believe in yourself. But it's very hard to believe in yourself when the overwhelming evidence indicates that you don't have what it takes. Belief may be a necessary condition for success, but it isn't sufficient. It doesn't matter if Symmonds believes that he can run 1:39. Rudisha will still own him.

Reaper wrote:

With better racing tactics he could have broken the AR and won the bronze last year.

Do explain, as I'm pretty sure Symmonds positive split the race.

Reaper wrote:

I think Symmond's quote is very telling and shows why he races the way he does. He has absolutely no confidence when racing Africans. He stays at the back because he's afraid to push himself. He goes into every race thinking that he won't/can't win and that 3rd or 4th place is good enough.

That's why he'll never medal or be a champion on the world scene. He doesn't believe in himself.

With better racing tactics he could have broken the AR and won the bronze last year. He needs to grow a pair and try to match the Africans. I wish he'd just have one race where he goes out in a 49.xx and sees what happens.

Symmonds could have always run a 1:42, but his lack of confidence and stupid tactics hold him back. It's a shame really...

i believe i can win and i can only run a 90 sec quarter

that would work

On the pacing of the 800, why we so often see positive splits:

http://www.britishmilersclub.com/bmcnews/news00.asp

Read the article in the autumn 2002 issue. The declining pace has to do with the 800 being short enough to utilize the CP and lactic systems, but just long enough to need the aerobic system twords the end. The problem is the aerobic system is not fast enough. In the article they lay out the most efficient pacing with that in mind.

for a world-class 800m guy, his speed (47.4 for 400) isn't where it might be, is what I think he is saying. Others might have moved up to 1500m, but I don't think that he believes he has the endurance for that (or the body-type either - although Snell had a similar body-type). He is stuck between a rock and a hard place if he wants to beat Rudisha as he is 2 seconds slower over 400m, yet possbily no better endurance. He has to be absolutely on his "A" game to run 1.43 or faster, and that can't always happen. His differential is 4.0sec, and Rudisha's is 5+. He could focus on getting his 1500 endurance better (low-3.30's), while maintaining his speed (47.4) to get that differential down to 3 seconds (47.4+3, x2 =1.40.8), but that is easier said than done.