Why Jamaican H.S. athletes do so well at Penn?

I think Jamaicans are faster than blacks in America. I went on vacation in Jamaica and the people as a whole looked much leaner than American blacks, even the athletes. That will probably change when Jamaicans can afford to buy more Twinkies.

You forgot to mention the most obvious reason which is that Jamaica has more sprint talent than USA.

Also, they are not going to local high schools.

Their secondary schools are called colleges and they recruit athletes.

If US regions could pool kids from different areas together in the same way it would change things.

* wrote:

Also, they are not going to local high schools.

Their secondary schools are called colleges and they recruit athletes.

If US regions could pool kids from different areas together in the same way it would change things.

There is some truth to that, although it is not entirely correct; however, the U.S. has some private schools that do that as well, although it tends to happen more for football and basketball purposes.

Justin91 wrote:

I think Jamaicans are faster than blacks in America. I went on vacation in Jamaica and the people as a whole looked much leaner than American blacks, even the athletes. That will probably change when Jamaicans can afford to buy more Twinkies.

White people in France are leaner than White people in America...you know where I am going with this.

TrackCoach wrote:

Justin91 wrote:

I think Jamaicans are faster than blacks in America. I went on vacation in Jamaica and the people as a whole looked much leaner than American blacks, even the athletes. That will probably change when Jamaicans can afford to buy more Twinkies.

White people in France are leaner than White people in America...you know where I am going with this.

That it explains Lemaitre? That the Jamaicans may remain lean as they get wealthier? That my "wealth an obesity" theory is falsified by the affluent but lean French?

FWIW, I'm basically anti-nutrition, but I do believe there are healthy habits, and avoiding snacking is #1. The French eat a rich diet, but they don't snack.

Jamaica College, Calabar, ST. Jago, Kingston College, Wolmer's Boys.

You see these Jamaican high schools all the ime.

US private schools aren't putting track teams together like that.

And yes, being one year older is a huge advantage.

Think about what soem of the college freshman could do againts high schoolers.

I think it's mostly a mix of #3 and #1, but all of the above do come into play.

Penn Relays, for the most part, is a meet for Northeast/Mid-Atlantic states with a sample of California athletes mixed in. If more California/Texas/Florida athletes (and others) were at Penn, it would make a difference, though it wouldn't solve the issue - Jamaica still would have an edge given the reasons you posted in the intro.

* wrote:

Jamaica College, Calabar, ST. Jago, Kingston College, Wolmer's Boys.

You see these Jamaican high schools all the ime.

US private schools aren't putting track teams together like that.

And yes, being one year older is a huge advantage.

Think about what soem of the college freshman could do againts high schoolers.

Perhaps those are the schools with the best coaching, feeder system and tradition, like a York or LBP for example.

the Jamaican School Championships are held just prior to PENN, they start spring track in January

Sooo, they are peaked and purring

US is just getting its outdoor legs

Retired Jamaican sprinters are put out to 'stud' like racehorses?

TrackCoach wrote:

The primary reason is the obvious ones, they are very good, well trained, highly motivated and have the pride and confidence born out of tradition. Track & Field after all is their national sport. The debate over the Jamaican relative dominates in the COA sprint relays will go on forever.

The major arguments are:

1. The Jamaican kids are on average a year older, a Jamaican H.S. senior is the age of a U.S. college freshman.

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TrackCoach it is obvious that you are as bias against the Jamaican athletes as most Americans are (assuming you're an American). I decided to read your thread because I knew that your main argument for "Why Jamaican H.S. do so well at Penn" would have been the "AGE" factor.

"The Jamaican kids are on average a year older, a Jamaican H.S. senior is the age of a U.S. college freshman".

This my friends is one of those things we hear growing up that we forget where we 1st heard it. Then we begin to believe this malarkey so much, we start to spread it as if its gospel. Even forgetting to fact-check our own bullshit because it sounds good when we become defenseless in explaining how a 3rd World Country with no proper training facilities can produce better athletes than the "GOOD OLE USA".

This fabrication is just as popular as that well known urban legend that if you win the lotto and die with out claiming all your winnings, the remain prize money cannot be willed to your children or estate.

This is so false that when I hear people saying it today, I ask GOD to please help them and to bless them with some knowledge.

What make these statements so interesting is… today! we have a thing called the World Wide Web/Internet and on the web we have a powerful search engine called GOOGLE.

I SUGGEST WE USE IT BEFORE POSTING NON-SENSE

Here are the facts:

1. The total required years for completing high school in Jamaica is 5.The 6th & 7th years(6th form) are optional and equivolent to post-secondary education.Each year is called a “FORM” therefore, 1st form….2nd form…3rd form etc…(based on the British Edu. system).A child entering the 1st form can be as young as 10/11, if you do the math we will see that the oldest seniors in a Jamaican HS is between the ages of 15 & 16.

I am sure just like here in the “GOOD OLE USA” there are always stragglers, dunce, educationally challenged… whatever we want to call them, who well take more than 5 years to complete their required portion of their HS education.

(look for United Kingdom)

Maybe these are the few student-athletes that TRACKCOACH is speaking of

Now! Because I know how to read and do simple math I will ask someone else to do so…

CAN SOME ONE PLEASE POINT ME TO THE STATE IN AMERICA WHERE THE AVERAGE HIGH SCHOOL SENIOR IS BETWEEN THE AGES OF 15-16?

The Jamaican educational system is structured to be a mirror image of the English (yes England) educationally system.

FOR THOSE OF US THAT DIDN’T KNOW…JAMAICA WAS ONCE A COLONY OF THE BRITISH MONARCH

2. Track and Field is not the National Sport of Jamaica, that sport would be Soccer/Football.

3. What makes H.S. Track and Field so popular in Jamaica is the institution that each student-athlete represents. Like the fanfare of the US college football/basketball sport systems, students and alumni identify winning a T&F championship with achieving Nirvana. Jamaican HS’s are held at an extremely high regard and to be able to say that my alma mater, my school or my team has won, is paramount.

TRACKCOACH: 2nd reason

“The warm climate and the point in the season. Most mid-Atlantic, NE and NW schools are barely half-way into their outdoor season, while the Jamaican kids have completed their championships. The clearest evidence of this comes from the U.S. national meets in June, which usually produces faster times than Penn.”

This is also a fallacy. If I were to comparing the times coming out of USA H.S. Track & Field Nationals, I would compare them to Jamaica’s Boys & Girls Championships. Not Penn Relays were conditions are poor for producing exceptional times.

I mean let’s think…End of April…in the North East of the United States, OK! Enough said.

Another thing about the above statement is: I cant recall a year when any Jamaican team run a faster wining time at Penn’s, that was better than their B&G Championship winning times.

TRACKCOACH: 3rd reason

“The top U.S. sprint talent comes from the warm weather states like California, Texas and Florida, which are underrepresented at Penn”.

This! I would have to agree with 100%. It's no secret that the top US high school performers aren’t represented well at Penn Relays but Jamaica has been attending Penn Relays since the 60s. Several California and Texas schools have attempted to dethrone them but they have only been successful a handful of times in the last 10years.

TrackCoach wrote:

The primary reason is the obvious ones, they are very good, well trained, highly motivated and have the pride and confidence born out of tradition. Track & Field after all is their national sport. The debate over the Jamaican relative dominates in the COA sprint relays will go on forever.

The major arguments are:

2. The warm climate and the point in the season. Most mid-Atlantic, NE and NW schools are barely half-way into their outdoor season, while the Jamaican kids have completed their championships. The clearest evidence of this comes from the U.S. national meets in June, which usually produces faster times than Penn.

I forgot to poke another hole in your argument:

Lets make a deal...I will bet anyone bragging rights if they can find a USA High School T&F 2012 sprint relay time that was faster than any of the final relay times posted at the 2012 Boys & Girls Championship in Jamaica.

What makes this even more interesting is: Jamaican H.S. run their relays on the 5th and final day of competition and I am daring anyone with "BALLS" to find this information.

If you need help with your research just let me know and I will kindly assist.

Yes. Many Jamaican high schoolers are 19.

Just looked up Jamaica College.

I had many Jamaican teammates in college that came in at age 19.

* wrote:

Yes. Many Jamaican high schoolers are 19.

Just looked up Jamaica College.

I had many Jamaican teammates in college that came in at age 19.

As I said...do your research before responding to my post.

Here is a hint: CLICK ON THE LINKS

From a public school will run there this week. It is the 2nd to last meet of the year for Texas kids.

great coaching pride in the sport and tradition are the reasons. Watch the Jamaican champs. It's beautiful to watch middle school kids perform perfect stick passes and sprint and hurdle with great form. I remember coaching my first Jamaican immigrant in my northeast HS. He took pride in being on a track team, he taught the others to tuck in their shirts and care for their track shoes. Hearty living doesn't hurt either. Let's enjoy the rivalry, even if we know we're gonna get our butts kicked.

the jamaicans have more of the sprint gene than americans, americans can compete well against the jamaicans because of superior technology and facilities and coaching, but an american sprinter must be made with incredibly hard work.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACTN3

its kind of like rupp he can compete with africans do to all this technology to help train with injury or prevent injury, medicines on the banned list that doctors give him an exemption for, and he often competes against runners who never even had shoes until age 20.

if jamaicans in the sprints, and kenyans/ethiopians had the same technology/facilities/ coaching as americans they would dominate because of genetics.

Actually, a lot of Jamaican kids run better at their own champs or Carifta than they do at Penn. Penn is almost past their peak and weather often a lot colder than their used to.

I think it's just that there's a very focused and concentrated passion down there for the sport -- especially sprints, jumps and relays -- that's tough to beat.