Kevin Castille Just Misses American Masters Record in 10k - Runs 29:39 at 2013 Crescent City Classic

Is that course record quality? It's point to point

John Tuttle ran 29:27 at Crescent City and it wasn't counted.

I think it is a new course.

Interesting how every Elite Woman is the age of 30.

close wrote:

Is that course record quality? It's point to point

wind behind them etc

THe new CCC course is record certified, proximity of start to finish is within legal bounds.

The 8KM course is not cetified, as it does not meet record specs.

Tuttle's CCC time was point to point time.

close wrote:

Is that course record quality? It's point to point

Please ignore that point to point crap.

OK- I've been running since 1971 (when a 6 mile race was anywhere from 5.8-6.3 miles).

Certification was a great innovation. But, I didn't like it when they started with the point to point garbage.

I remember when running fast at Boston was running fast NOT something that some loser could dispute. Boston was tough because of the hills so everyone respected the times.

Run fast on a course like Crescent City? You were putting one foot in front of another really fast- that's it.

It's road racing you take the hills and the courses as they are.

Hey runn I'm with you. I was just pointing out to posters the possible reason the effort by Tuttle was overlooked by some. Certanily I concer.

I know one thing, Mr. Tuttle certainly enjoyed the CCC post race party.

runn wrote:

It's road racing you take the hills and the courses as they are.

Yes. In racing.

And in record-keeping you take the courses by their certification.

Otherwise you could just set up a point-to-point straight on a prairie highway, wait for a nice windy day, say 30mph winds, and break some records.

Sound familiar (cough, cough, Boston 2011)?

Make that the Allstate Sugar Bowl Crescent Classic.

Update: We apologize for originally having a typo and saying Castille ran 27:39 instead of 29:39. We have since found an article on just Castille. Kudos for him also being the first American in the race.Castille said the conditions in the race were ideal but he had to run most of it totally alone.

hhttp://www.nola.com/running/index.ssf/2013/03/lafayette_native_kevin_castill_1.html

The overall race was won by London 5k 5th placer and 12:48 man Isaiah Koech in his road debut in 27:32.

He set an unofficial world-record 8K time of 21:54 in the race

http://www.nola.com/running/index.ssf/2013/03/isaiah_koech_breaks_away_from.html

runn wrote:

close wrote:

Is that course record quality? It's point to point

Please ignore that point to point crap.

OK- I've been running since 1971 (when a 6 mile race was anywhere from 5.8-6.3 miles).

Certification was a great innovation. But, I didn't like it when they started with the point to point garbage.

I remember when running fast at Boston was running fast NOT something that some loser could dispute. Boston was tough because of the hills so everyone respected the times.

Run fast on a course like Crescent City? You were putting one foot in front of another really fast- that's it.

It's road racing you take the hills and the courses as they are.

Agreed. These should be races and take the courses. We should have course records and not worry about rabbits, etc.

Why are the open elite american men afraid to race ? Crescent City is a fast race and always competitive.

Chicken Little wrote:

Why are the open elite american men afraid to race ? Crescent City is a fast race and always competitive.

Is it because most of our guys are focused on the track at this time of year?

This is correct, otherwise you'd have records set on all sorts of straight downhill races. There has to be restrictions.

I'm 90% positive they certified the 8k.

Top American is 40 years old plus and is more then 2 minutes behind the winner.

Sad

Gracie wrote:

I'm 90% positive they certified the 8k.

The 8k was certified, there was a mat at the mark and hand-timers recording the efforts, but there are still differing opinions over whether it's record legal based on separation.

The term "certified" ought to be distinguished from the term "validated". The former indicates that the course is the distance advertised, the latter that it's situated in such a manner to allow for a record performance.

The first course (Nenow 27:22) wasn't even close to validate-able, though that wasn't a concern at that point.

The second course (Kipketer 27:11/Ochichi 30:27) was close to legal.

The current 10k course is within the allowable 50% separation limit.

Chicken Little wrote:

Why are the open elite american men afraid to race ? Crescent City is a fast race and always competitive.

I don't think this is a fair statement. Until this year, the Classic hadn't upped its prize structure since about 1996. I'm not a fan of "American-only money" but figured doubling anything won by an American this year would be an incentive.

Americans are well-advised to steer clear of the race. Until there's some sort of equalizer placed, there just isn't a spot for them unless they're willing to mix it up with a lot of people who can run 28:20 or 32:20 or better.

To put it into perspective, Paula Radcliffe came and finished second in 2005 (sub 31 to Ochichi's 30:27). Americans of half Paula's road stature wouldn't come to the race for 1/10th of the appearance (read: meal money) fee she was given.

Would love to get some Americans in, but with limited funds we have to produce the best results we can. Could be a change or two which would allow for an American-only race at some point, but for now the focus has got to be on growing the race to its former size before we start paying the fees that American athletes require.

I'm surprised the record is that slow. Eight percent slower than Nenow's overall AR.

29.62/27.38 = 1.08

compare the records for 800 meters (both Johnny Gray)

108.8/102.6 = 1.06

Only 6 percent slower.

I thought speed went first, then endurance.

10,000: 30.07/26.73 = 1.12

1,500: 224/209 = 1.07, and Lagat will lower it further