Anyone have any thoughts on the minimum speed someone has to have over 400m/800m to be in shape for a 4 minute mile (Not 59/1:59 smartasses)? Obviously a more middle distance oriented athlete will have to have closer to 1:50/51 and 50.x speed but what about a 3k/5k type runner? I'd imagine some sub 14 type guys have done it without crazy fast speed.
I'm guessing ~55ish speed for the open 400 COULD get you there. I knew a guy who ran 4:04 closing in 55s who ran many 4x4s without ever breaking 54.
A minimum speed of 15.01 mph should do it.
Gerry Lindgren ran 4:01 as a high school senior and had a PB of about 55 I believe. Probably could have gone sub 4 but rarely ran the mile after high school.
be serious wrote:
I'm guessing ~55ish speed for the open 400 COULD get you there. I knew a guy who ran 4:04 closing in 55s who ran many 4x4s without ever breaking 54.
He was obviously faster than 54 on those days that he closed in 55
This question has been asked many times, and the answer seems to be 52 and 1:52. There are probably exceptions, but for the vast majority of runners, you're gonna need to be in 52/1:52 shape to break 4:00. If you want to check you can look at guys from indoor NCAAs over the years. Most nowadays are 3:55-4:01 types. You'll find that almost every ~4:00 guy who actually runs the 800m at least once in a while has a PR of 1:49-1:52. Your typical 4:00 dude is going to be a 1:50 or 1:51 man. Running
52 sounds like it might be about right 1:52 could be a little fast I could see someone with 1:53 or even low 1:54 speed with the right endurance doing it
From Coach Horwill, rest his soul:
1:52? Ridiculous.
High school kids reach 1;52 pretty often, but they rarely get to 4 minute 1600 let alone mile. The 800 meter WR was sub-1:47 before anyone ran a sub-4 mile.
Sorry but you're gonna have to go WICKED fast over 800 to do a 4-minute mile. Around 1:47. Which means your 400 pace should be 107/2.2 = 48.6.
I'm not always rude, but the answers saying 52 or 1:52 are idiots.
Bad Wigins wrote:
1:52? Ridiculous.
High school kids reach 1;52 pretty often, but they rarely get to 4 minute 1600 let alone mile. The 800 meter WR was sub-1:47 before anyone ran a sub-4 mile.
Sorry but you're gonna have to go WICKED fast over 800 to do a 4-minute mile. Around 1:47. Which means your 400 pace should be 107/2.2 = 48.6.
I'm not always rude, but the answers saying 52 or 1:52 are idiots.
not sure if trolling
someone had to do it wrote:
not sure if trolling
how about 1:52 being in sub-4 league, are you sure about that?
Bannister ran about 1:52 for 880 yards. 1:50.7 for 800 meters. He was about 6 2 and very slim with a great aerobic system.
be serious wrote:
I'm guessing ~55ish speed for the open 400 COULD get you there.
And what planet are you living on?
The same year he first ran 1:52, Bannister's best mile was 4:11. When he ran that 1:50.7, his mile PR was 4:07. And the 1:50 was his major championship debut, not a rabbited race. He was nowhere near the condition he was in in 1954.
A better measure would be Wes Santee with PR's of 4:00.5 and 1:47.9.
No one could break four minutes off 55 speed. You really 50 speed, although a few can do it with 52.
Bad Wigins wrote:
High school kids reach 1;52 pretty often, but they rarely get to 4 minute 1600 let alone mile. The 800 meter WR was sub-1:47 before anyone ran a sub-4 mile.
You seem to think the OP's question was what 800 time is equivalent to a 4min mile. I think there have been a few sub-4 guys who were not capable of 1:47.
No one ever seems to have any hard evidence on this but there are always stories of people doing it on pretty shitty speed (for sub 4 that is). I'd be interested to know if anyone has hard facts cause I can't remember specific examples.
dukerdog wrote:
I think there have been a few sub-4 guys who were not capable of 1:47.
A few, sure. Far fewer who couldn't beat 1:50. As Bannister would have if he hadn't focused on the mile for four years.
The OP is basically trying to predict sub-4 with 400/800 times. 1:52 doesn't predict sub-4 or even close. 4:10-ish is the equivalent.
Guppy wrote:
This question has been asked many times, and the answer seems to be 52 and 1:52. There are probably exceptions, but for the vast majority of runners, you're gonna need to be in 52/1:52 shape to break 4:00. If you want to check you can look at guys from indoor NCAAs over the years. Most nowadays are 3:55-4:01 types. You'll find that almost every ~4:00 guy who actually runs the 800m at least once in a while has a PR of 1:49-1:52. Your typical 4:00 dude is going to be a 1:50 or 1:51 man. Running
Guppy, you haven't a clue. Did you read the thread title?
Bad Wigins wrote:
1:52? Ridiculous.
High school kids reach 1;52 pretty often, but they rarely get to 4 minute 1600 let alone mile. The 800 meter WR was sub-1:47 before anyone ran a sub-4 mile.
Sorry but you're gonna have to go WICKED fast over 800 to do a 4-minute mile. Around 1:47. Which means your 400 pace should be 107/2.2 = 48.6.
I'm not always rude, but the answers saying 52 or 1:52 are idiots.
And you are an even bigger idiot.