Coe's multipaced 800m-1500m training.

The books says what those workouts are, but basically:

Aerobic conditioning = distance runs (ex. 6-8 miles, 7:00-7:30/mile)

Anaerobic conditioning = tempo runs (ex. 4 miles, 6:00-6:15/mile)

Aerobic capacity = long intervals (ex. 8x800m, 2:45, 2 min rest)

Anaerobic capacity = short intervals (ex. 10x400m, 74, 1:30 rest)

The Coe/Martin book (Better Training for Distance Runners) goes into much more scientific detail but that's basically what they are. Hope this helps

What does 6 minute miling have to do with 'anaerobic conditioning' even for a 17 minute 5k runner?

And what does 74 second laps have to do with 'anaerobic capacity' ?

In both cases, such terminology is very innacurate and misleading.

Anaerobic work is sprinting. High heart rates, traditionally called 'anearobic' training are really high end aerobic.

This is what Peter Coe means when he uses these terms

Aerobic Conditioning: Easy Running

Anaerobic Conditioning: Steady State Running (marathon race pace -> half marathon race pace)

Aerobic Capacity: 10k Race pace - 3k Race Pace

Anaerobic Capacity: 1500m Race Pace - 800m Race Pace

Sprint: 400m Race Pace - Maximum Effort

Download these starting with Autumn 98:

http://www.britishmilersclub.com/bmcnews/news90.asp

Peter Coe training

What Coe named these intensities is beside the point. Call them Dragon's Breath if you want to. Just know how to use it.

Don't train like the seb Coe. You WILL forget how many miles you run per week.

R.A rugged man wrote:

Don't train like the seb Coe. You WILL make up how many miles you run per week.

fixed

clearing the bs up wrote:

This is what Peter Coe means when he uses these terms

Aerobic Conditioning: Easy Running

Anaerobic Conditioning: Steady State Running (marathon race pace -> half marathon race pace)

Aerobic Capacity: 10k Race pace - 3k Race Pace

Anaerobic Capacity: 1500m Race Pace - 800m Race Pace

Sprint: 400m Race Pace - Maximum Effort

No that is not what Peter Coe meant at all. Steady state runnning is not anaerobic conditioning. And 800 and 1500 is not anaerobic capacity. Anaerobic = sprinting.

OK, "basic physiology", if that is not what Peter Coe meant at all, than what, specifically, did he mean?

The diagram on page 67 of Winning Running describes the zone between 75% and 90% of VO2 max as "Anaerobic Conditioning" and the zone between 100% and 130% of VO2 max as "Anaerobic Capacity Training" or 1500-800 pace. Those terms may not be "accurate" but they are the terms that Peter Coe used and poster "clearing up the bs" had the way Peter Coe used the terms exactly right.

Peter Coe, or David Martin?

75% to 90% is most definitely aerobic conditioning and not anaerobic, surely you understand that?

What is anaerobic capacity anyway? There are four different anaerobic pathways, and there is really no such thing as an anaerobic threshold.

To put it simply, the first lap of an 800m race is mostly anaerobic and the second is mostly aerobic. This is basic physiology, but most authors don't seem to realize or even care.

basic physiology wrote:

Peter Coe, or David Martin?

75% to 90% is most definitely aerobic conditioning and not anaerobic, surely you understand that?

What is anaerobic capacity anyway? There are four different anaerobic pathways, and there is really no such thing as an anaerobic threshold.

To put it simply, the first lap of an 800m race is mostly anaerobic and the second is mostly aerobic. This is basic physiology, but most authors don't seem to realize or even care.

"This is what Peter Coe means when he uses these terms"

"This is what Peter Coe means when he uses these terms"

"This is what Peter Coe means when he uses these terms"

"This is what Peter Coe means when he uses these terms"

Call it fruit loops if you want, it doesn't matter. What matters is what he means when he uses these terms, and I defined them EXACTLY as they are in his book. In fact I have the book "Winning Running" open right in front of me. On page 67 he has the table that shows and defines these terms. I was correct in my original post when I stated what he means when he uses each term.

You can believe that you know more than Peter Coe and David Martin, that's fine. I'll take their word over yours though since Martin has a PhD and knows what he is talking about.

Next time you are so quick to correct someone you should probably take a look at what you're correcting so that you're not flat out wrong.

basic physiology wrote:

To put it simply, the first lap of an 800m race is mostly anaerobic and the second is mostly aerobic. This is basic physiology, but most authors don't seem to realize or even care.

So your aerobic system takes time to rev up. What brilliant insights into actual training should we draw from this?

Actually, I'll give you one which Seb and Peter did draw. They were into very thorough warmups. In the Haringey Sunday sessions late in his career, we'd do things like 3x400 in 70,68,66 as the last stage of a warmup, just 2min before a really hard 1500 or 800 session. The reasoning was that if you toed the line with the aerobic system running warm, your heart would get up to speed sooner and you'd run up less lactate in the first lap. One of the books did argue for a reasonable-length (300m?) rep in the warmup, instead of most people's 10sec strides.

Unfortunately, it's hard to do this kind of thing before an actual race, especially championships.

Two points, one: there must be a misprint, because training up to VO2 max is most definitely mostly aerobic, not anaerobic.

Two: Martin may have a PhD but his knowledge of what is aerobic and what is anaerobic is just plain wrong, like so many other authors. Read Noakes, he will put you straight.

If you really want to clear up the BS, stop reading Martin and read Noakes.

eurodonkey wrote:

So your aerobic system takes time to rev up. What brilliant insights into actual training should we draw from this?

Actually, I'll give you one which Seb and Peter did draw. They were into very thorough warmups. In the Haringey Sunday sessions late in his career, we'd do things like 3x400 in 70,68,66 as the last stage of a warmup, just 2min before a really hard 1500 or 800 session. The reasoning was that if you toed the line with the aerobic system running warm, your heart would get up to speed sooner and you'd run up less lactate in the first lap. One of the books did argue for a reasonable-length (300m?) rep in the warmup, instead of most people's 10sec strides.

Unfortunately, it's hard to do this kind of thing before an actual race, especially championships.

Plasma volume. When it's high, you can't run fast for long. The optimum warm up will give the optimum plasma volume. Finding and guessing that is an art in itself since we are all different.

I am pretty sure with 2 editions of the Martin/Coe book and "Winning Running," there was not a misprint. You can call whatever paces whatever you want, but the OP was asking about COE'S multipace method and what comes from the book itself. Why don't you read one of the two books by Coe? Out of curiousity, do you have a PhD in physiology?

basic physiology wrote:

Two points, one: there must be a misprint, because training up to VO2 max is most definitely mostly aerobic, not anaerobic.

Two: Martin may have a PhD but his knowledge of what is aerobic and what is anaerobic is just plain wrong, like so many other authors. Read Noakes, he will put you straight.

If you really want to clear up the BS, stop reading Martin and read Noakes.

Two points

1) No. There is no misprint. It is the same in "Better Training For Distance Runners."

2) So it is wrong because you disagree with him? Right.

You're contributing nothing to this thread, just stop posting. The OP was asking what is in Coe's book. I answered his question with exactly what is written in Coe's book. Stop quibbling over meaningless terms. All that matters is that you know how to apply those terms.

So you're saying that a marathon is anaerobic? According to the definition you post it must be?

Do you not see the problem here. There is certainly some BS to be cleared up, but you can't or won't do it.

basic physiology wrote:

So you're saying that a marathon is anaerobic? According to the definition you post it must be?

Do you not see the problem here. There is certainly some BS to be cleared up, but you can't or won't do it.

Get the f*ck out of here. You are not contributing to this thread, idiot.

Yes I am contributing. I am saying that Those definitions are complete and utter BS.

They were from David Martin, not Peter Coe.