base training

Good job on getting in the miles befor the season starts. Now the really intresting thing about Lyidard training, is that if you have never done it befor. Your going to be in for a wild and wonderfull season. As far as time drops, no-one can tell you what will end up happing.

What I can tell you is that if you have not been doing speedwork, which is good. Then the frist three weeks of your season your going to feel like you wasted your summer doing a lot of long easy miles. And there is a good chance that you will at the start of the season get passed by people who worked less then you. But From weeks 3-9 magic is going to happen. The best advice I can give you is just go out there and run each race as hard as you can, and then watch what happens to your times by the end of the season.

I'd have to caution you against running to quickly in the beginning of the season. As a young runner, a bump up in mileage to 90 mpw and a 22 mile long run might make you burn out if you push too hard. My advice would be to hold back in your first races and turn it on at the end of the season. It's no fun to run slower times throughout the season- believe me I made the overtraining mistake when I was 17.

Thankx for all your advice. but is it possible that i will run at least sub 16 or better or am i just wasting my time?

I wouldn't worry too much about times in cross races, they're all relative. Sounds like you are preparing well for the upcoming season, just get out there and compete.

Be careful with those weekly 22 milers. You might want to alternate those 22's with 12's the next weekend so you get some type of recovery. I'd do a tempo run once a week so you can develop leg speed. Don't forget about doing some strides at the end of your runs. If you're following Lydiard on some kind of daily schedule, that would probably be a mistake.

Just a note/question. 22 miler at 6:48 pace? I'm a sub 15 5ker and sub 31 10ker and I know I couldn't do that. So either you're in unbelievable shape, or something.

Not saying I don't believe you, but if you are doing that 22 mile run that fast, I greatly suggest slowing it down about 30 secs a mile.

Yea i kno . that 6:48 pace use to be comfortably hard for me (160 hr), but now it is 150 hr. the effort gets easier. so wat time do you think i would be capoable of doing when xc starts. i want ur honest opinions. thanks for all ur advice.

dude, if you can't do 22 miles at 6:48 pace, then you are SORELY under-developed aerobically. i'm not even a sub-16 5ker (well, i think i could do that right now, just haven't raced) and i can do 6:20s for 22 miles.man, i'd love to be sub-15/sub-31... --------------------------------------------------------------

helpingout wrote:

Just a note/question. 22 miler at 6:48 pace? I'm a sub 15 5ker and sub 31 10ker and I know I couldn't do that. So either you're in unbelievable shape, or something.

Not saying I don't believe you, but if you are doing that 22 mile run that fast, I greatly suggest slowing it down about 30 secs a mile.

With the training your doing I would expect that you will run under 16:00 for the 5k, in cross. You should have no problem doing so.

As to the training that your doing, running high miles is not going to kill ya. And it is not going to burn you out as some people say. As long as you control the pace, run the miles nice and easy. And save anytype of workout for the season. Just keep running easy, no tempos, just easy miles. Your still young and running a larg number of miles is all your body needs to be dealing with.

thanx for the advice. but i need more advice. where is malmo and jk. i need more responses

Caught in the flag,

You think you can go that far and that fast, or you know you can? Truth is, I could probably run 22 miles at 6:20's, but I also know that that kind of effort would take me a week to recover from. I do 15 mile runs, at 6:30-6:40 pace, and its not strenuous, but my hips and knees and joints start breaking down. It gets exponentially worse after about 13.5-14 miles. I can't imagine 22. I know its all a matter of building up to that though.

Anyway Olu, I would think that you would easily be able to break 16. Just be smart and don't get hurt. And don't be doing junk miles. 90 MPW for a 5k is a lot of miles to put in for a 17 year old.

thanx for the advice. today i did the lydiard 3/4th efforts which is 160-174 hr. i ran 10 miles in 59:05, which is 5:54 pace, and i felt greAT.my hr was 168.

olu. The long run is highly over-rated. At your level and mileage go about 14 or so - 17-18 at max, and not on a weekly basis.

You'll be better off- I'm sure of it.

Keep up the good work.

Malmo, what do you think for a high 14 minute 5k'er? I normally do 16 every week and do about 80 mpw. Thanks for the help.

Olu, you are either lying about your 5k PR or lying about these workouts you are doing. Either way, you are a liar and I hate you.

Nah, it's possible he could crank out 22M in slightly under 2.5 hrs. If he's been doing high miles and increasing his fitness, it's not impossible. It's way too fast for a long run, however. 22 mile runs are more indicative of marathon training, and they can hurt leg turnover big time.

I trained similarly in HS and could only average 5:20 miles for a 5K, but then realized I could run 5:25's for 10 miles on pavement. This seems possible for our boy Olu. I'd recommend forgetting about cross-country and shooting for a fall marathon if you can maintain your training. That would turn a few heads.

16 a little high, but OK.

22 miles each week certainly does not take any speed out of the legs or hurt leg turnover. of course those runs may be more indicative of marathon training, but thats if you stay in that type of training for long periods of time without shorter fast stuff. i ran a PR under 400 meters after doing this type of work.

as far as olu should be concerned, listen to malmo as your elderstatesman; at your age and racing level, thats just too much. why are you trying to develop so soon? just have fun and develop your long range goals rather than trying to find some quick fix training. if you're really going to do the lydiard training though, word to the wise is read up on it. its obvious you havn't read much at all about it and don't know how long it can take before you run your best off that type of training.

Olu, you know your maximum heart rate?