When I was in high school in the 80s, my coach and fellow runners talked about being in "oxygen debt." I was never really sure what it meant, but I think we used it to mean that feeling about a minute into a middle distance race (e.g. 800 or mile) when you went out too fast.
Is the term "oxygen debt" used today? What does it mean?
What does "oxygen debt" mean? Is that term used today?
Training Advice/Discussion
General
Report Thread
You are reporting this thread to the moderators for review and possible removal from the forum.
-
-
That is an old out of fashion term. Alactic might be the term more used today.
I heard it all the time in HS. It was used when we ran so hard and fast that we got dizzy, and puked. -
We used to use it quite a bit and I'm sure it's still used. Basically your muscles are expending more oxygen than what your body is able to supply.
-
The Chinese hold all our O2 debt. We will need to pay interest by breathing less in the future.
-
Oxygen deficit could also fit... but I see that more in engineering than in running.
-
Oxygen debt is what happens to liberals when they keep yapping and yapping without taking a breath about how deficit spending helps the economy.
-
Right when you start running and your body hasnt yet up regulated the oxygen supply
-
Limp Kitten wrote:
Is the term "oxygen debt" used today? What does it mean?
I use the term on a daily basis when seeing runners in practice with nary a clue gasping for air or in track and road races when people are huffing and puffing as they slog along.
If you can hear yourself breathing you are in oxygen debt, trying to write a check your body can't cash.
Your blood needs oxygen, you got in over your head with a too quick pace and your very tired, oxygen starved muscles are in a whole lot of pain because of the poor choices you made.
I think Jack Daniels has a famous old quote, something like...
"most runners make a mistake in the first mile, usually in the first 440 yards" or you can listen to Bowerman who said,
"you don't win the first lap, you win the last."
Even pacing, keeping the breathing under control will assure your legs will not turn to lead.
high school and junior high school kids always make the mistake of collapsing to their knees gasping for air which is the worst thing you can do, but these nancy boys have to learn their lesson the hard way, you can to jog or walk and stand tall and your breathing will return to normal much quicker and it's safer than dropping your head below your heart when it is pumping 180bpm. -
Whenever you finished a race, or an intense workout, did you immediately breath normally, as soon as you stopped running, or was it heavier than normal, taking some time to resume back to normality? If there is a difference, this difference in oxygen consumption can be measured.
The concept of oxygen debt was that, during a race, you consumed so much energy, that you effectively "borrowed" oxygen, creating a debt, by providing "anaerobic" energy, which was ultimately repaid during the race, and for some extended time after, with heavy breathing and intake of oxygen.
This kind of effect is easily measured by how much oxygen you consume during and after a race, versus how much you consumed normally, without racing.
The concept is outdated, because it was assumed that the extra oxygen you consumed, "post-race", was a proxy (a good estimate) for how much "anaerobic" energy you produced during the race. New ways to measure "anaerobic energy production" showed that post-race excess oxygen consumption drastically over-estimates "anaerobic" energy consumption.
I think the term is seldom used today. -
rekrunner wrote:
I think the term is seldom used today.
Think again.
That was one of the most confusing, convoluted INCORRECT
answers I have read in a long time.
Take two runners side-by-side on the track, one in shape, one out of shape. Make them run a sixty second quarter together, at the same time, side-by-side. The in shape runner will come in breathing fine, the out of shape runner pushing beyond their fitness and ability level tries to keep up with the in shape runner and may come close, but at a price. They know they are in over their head, that they have gone overboard and are drowning (not getting enough oxygen) to run effectively and efficiently. They pay the price for their effort (maybe they gave 110%) by gasping and wheezing and falling apart over the final 100 meters and taking so much longer to recover and feeling the pain of doing too much (running at a pace too fast for their body to process oxygen and deliver the oxygen rich blood to the muscles).
It is a term often used today, by those in the know and no, you don't have to have a Ph.D. in Exercise Physiology to understand this simple concept and practice. -
Wow. That was one of the most confusing, convoluted INCORRECT responses I have read in a long time.
But as you suggest, I thought about it again. Maybe you are right that the term is still used often. I cannot assume that many have done even the modest limited research I have done, without ever having to leave this very forum. I assumed that a concept that has been revised for decades would eventually make itself known by many experienced coaches on the track. But now that you have spoken for all of those "in the know", I see that was a generous assumption.
Even your "in-shape" 400m runner will be breathing heavier than normal after a 60 second 400m. This measurable post effort oxygen consumption will over-estimate the anaerobic energy production, according to the oxygen debt model.
So while I used to think that is was "seldom used" today, you have at least convinced me to no longer take a position on the frequency of the current use of this term. I see now that I cannot speak for the many who are "in the know".
Nevertheless, the concept is outdated, as a measure of aerobic and anaerobic energy production, as it overestimates the anaerobic component of energy production.
experienced coach wrote:
Think again.
That was one of the most confusing, convoluted INCORRECT
answers I have read in a long time.
Take two runners side-by-side on the track, one in shape, one out of shape. Make them run a sixty second quarter together, at the same time, side-by-side. The in shape runner will come in breathing fine, the out of shape runner pushing beyond their fitness and ability level tries to keep up with the in shape runner and may come close, but at a price. They know they are in over their head, that they have gone overboard and are drowning (not getting enough oxygen) to run effectively and efficiently. They pay the price for their effort (maybe they gave 110%) by gasping and wheezing and falling apart over the final 100 meters and taking so much longer to recover and feeling the pain of doing too much (running at a pace too fast for their body to process oxygen and deliver the oxygen rich blood to the muscles).
It is a term often used today, by those in the know and no, you don't have to have a Ph.D. in Exercise Physiology to understand this simple concept and practice. -
Your most recent response was even more entertaining than your first.
You continue to be wrong and clueless.
I am picturing you walking around with a slide rule
as you "measure aerobic and anaerobic energy production".
I guess my advice to you now is, DON'T...think again.
You tried it and it didn't work, it's time to move on.
You said,
"Even your "in-shape" 400m runner will be breathing heavier than normal"
Now you have to define normal, something you may not have a grasp on. An in-shape runner will run within themselves, comfortably under control and will not experience oxygen debt because they are conditioned to handle the task.
That is why you see inexperienced, immature runners doing it all in practice and having nothing for race day.
Smart runners know what time to run their track repeats in and give themselves the proper rest interval between each.
Try not to turn this into rocket science, because you are not up for the challenge. Training and racing can be quite simple and success can be yours if common sense is your constant companion.
When you are regularly in oxygen debt, you are a poor runner and would do well to listen to an experienced coach. -
experienced coach wrote:
high school and junior high school kids always make the mistake of collapsing to their knees gasping for air which is the worst thing you can do, but these nancy boys have to learn their lesson the hard way, you can to jog or walk and stand tall and your breathing will return to normal much quicker and it's safer than dropping your head below your heart when it is pumping 180bpm.
Actually, you are totally wrong.
The heart rate and breathing return to normal very quickly when laying down on the ground, and faster when standing with your hands on your needs than with jogging. The faster you jog, the longer it takes for your heart rate and breathing to return to normal. -
close minded coach wrote:
Actually, you are totally wrong.
breathing return to normal very quickly when laying down on the ground, and faster when standing with your hands on your needs
Yes, I am often totally wrong.
It takes a greater mind than mine to point that out. Thank you. We all have our wants and our needs. From my experience coaching h.s., college and professional runners I will nevertheless continue to suggest they jog recover, rather than collapse flat on the ground or put their hands on their "needs". -
Im with rekrunner on this. Experienced coach are you even trying to define the term? or are you just telling us that in shape runners can run easier than out of shape runners?
-
Dear Experienced Coach,
As an unbiased reader who opened this thread to gain knowledge, I want to let you know that you are coming off as an illiterate blow hard.
Sincerely, huwtf -
Technically, the degree to which, while engaged in activity, you are consuming more oxygen than you're supplying is an oxygen deficit.
Once you have stopped the activity, you have an oxygen debt, which you "pay back" by breathing more deeply than required by your then-current activity.
I'm sorry, that really reads awkwardly. My copy of Åstrand and Rodahl was among the books I gave away a few years ago, so I can't look up their (better) phrasing for you.
But in essence, while you're "in the midst" you have an oxygen deficit; afterward you have an oxygen debt. -
yep thats it, i got it mixed up before
-
huwtf wrote:
an unbiased reader who opened this thread to gain knowledge, you are an illiterate blow hard.
Sincerely, huwtf
Gain knowledge?
Here let me help...
illiterate means "A person who is unable to read or write."
Nope. Not me.
Have I given the OP an explanation or definition of "oxygen debt"?
Yes, several times. In a way that runners (remember, I have coached h.s., college and professional runners) can easily understand in a group session without overwhelming them or taxing their brains.
If they want to do further research in a book or online, they can and if they chose can read all about alactic, Glycolysis, The Krebs Cycle, Oxidative Phosphorylation,
but I am going to coach them in simplified terms they can easily grasp without dwelling on the science or practice would never move forward if it turned into a science debate.
I coach distance runners, not rocket scientists and I choose
to keep practice fun and enjoyable for the long run. -
Keep on digging experienced coach!
