Post-Collegiate training groups

Amenities? ... coffee shot out my nose. Thanks for the laugh.

under the radar wrote:

I'd be interested to see a list of all the different serious post-collegiate training groups there are out there, as well as what it might take to land a spot on each of the teams, and what amenities are provided by the group (Financial support, shoe sponsor, coaching, where the group is located, housing, employment etc..) It seems like there are new groups popping up all over the place, and I was wondering if anyone had taken the time to make a list of them all, and compare them. I bet there are a bunch of talented collegiate kids out there that would be really interested in this kind of stuff.

The only group that offers the amenity of "coffee shooting out of your nose" is Team USA Indiana.......

Wait, maybe I'm thinking about their coffee enemas........

This is what the REAL training centers take care of.

FREE HOUSING

FREE TRAVEL

FREE COACHING

FREE EQUIPMENT

FREE HEALTH INSURANCE

FREE MASSAGE

FREE PHYSICAL THERAPY

Any thing less than this is only a group of runners running together.

A huge red flag to stay away is when the group says "we will help you find housing" that is code for YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN. The same is true if the group expects you to have your own shoe deal.

i'm also interested

i'm not an all american or anything, but i've put up decently respectable college times after a life of anonymity in high school. would sponsors like adidas be interested in someone who shows great progression and maybe just throw some gear and shoes at me for upcoming post collegiate training?

Find a group that will help you continue improving AND help you make the trnsition from college to profession. Any team that prevents you from pursuing your graduate degree or encourage you to work is setting you up for failure in life.

The Kenyans enter the military or police force and still romp the world.

Maybe it is our primma donna culture that has it backwards.

I could probably rattle off the top of my head (and count on no more than both hands, if that) the number of training centers that offer all that. And if the OP has the numbers to get picked up by one of those training centers, he wouldn't be asking about it on LRC. We'd probably already recognize his / her name. Plenty of emerging runners make it with less than all-inclusive deals, working side jobs (part or full time), and still succeed. It's about the quality of the coaching, the other runners, and how well the philosophy and environment of the group match up with the individual athlete.

I talked to a coach in a one of the running hot spots. He said he'd help me find housing, and a job too. He also promised sponsorships and training stipends. After eventually moving there on my own steam, I found out that he didn't have any real contacts, and actually didn't know anything about training in general. He was just a professional runner himself who talked a big game.

What did I learn? Don't join any group or listen to any coach that isn't already well established...

I believe joe vigil put it best when asked if he believed his athletes should have jobs. "Jobs? Running your best is a job, and requires every ounce of physical and emotional energy." The truth is that the vast majority of our (and the world's) very best from the 800m to the marathon run - and that is their job. Can you run well and work? Yes. Will you be your best? History has proven no. Why is it that so many refuse to see our sport in the same light as pro tennis, football, or any other pro sport - hell in many ways ours takes more energy. If you can find a situation which allows you to focus 100% on your running, my advice is put all your eggs in one basket. Go for it wholeheartedly.

MarathonSean wrote:

I talked to a coach in a one of the running hot spots. He said he'd help me find housing, and a job too. He also promised sponsorships and training stipends. After eventually moving there on my own steam, I found out that he didn't have any real contacts, and actually didn't know anything about training in general. He was just a professional runner himself who talked a big game.

What did I learn? Don't join any group or listen to any coach that isn't already well established...

this sounds like a certain little group of a certain little bald "coach" in a certain little yuppie town in Colorado....

sometimes you just have to laugh.

Lets try to get back on topic here because so far no one has actually answered the OP's question. I'd be really interested to hear some answers as well since I'm in a similar situation looking to make a move to some kind of group within the next year.

Anyway some of these are the big ones which you don't need me to tell you about and all the info on their standards and what they give you are on their site. I'm not good enough for some of these and you probably aren't either. The less known ones I've just heard of from friends who are part of them. They're more realistic for sub-elite college runners. You can google all of these and I think they all have websites. [Disclaimer, I'm doing this off the top of my head, so if I get some info wrong, sue me.]

-Hanson Brooks Distance Project (Michigan, give you lots of financial help, probably need ~2:20 marathon, maybe 29:00 10k, marathon focus.)

-McMillian Elite (Flagstaff, AZ ... don't know their standards, but they're fast. Think they're Adidas?)

-Zap Fitness (North Carolina, Reebok gear, to get the full ride you need to be pretty fast, like Olympic Trials fast I think, but they have a second tier program for like 66 minute half marathon, 2:22 marathon, 14:30 5k, 30:00 10k guys. The elites get a lot, the sub-elite get some gear, some help with travel, coaching, and some meals. I have no idea what "some" means, but it's pretty much how specific their website is.

-Indiana Team Eliete (Bloomington, IN; Brooks gear; I have no idea what they give, probably a decent amount, but their standards are at least the Olympic B Standard in your event. Since there is no B Standard for the half marathon or full, I don't know what they'd want for these events, but I've seen their guys run anywhere from 62 minutes to high 67 on a bad day. Also they're probably not really a marathon group in general from what I've seen.)

-Asics Aggies (Northern California I think??? I don't remember much about them, I think they might have multiple standards as well. I remember looking at their website and being a bit confused as to how one would become a member and what you get out of it.)

-Stotan Racing (Syracuse, NY ... not sure what they give you, but they have a lot of guys in the 30minute range for 10k, 67 minute range for half marathon. They're best guy is an OT Marathon qualifier. Coached by Coach Aris, the coach for FM high school. I would have thought about joinging this group except I've heard their training is pretty crazy out there and most people get hurt. Well, they get good if they stay healthy/don't burn out I guess.)

-Syracuse Chargers (Syracuse, NY ... I think they give some travel and maybe some gear? Don't know their standards, but they're probably one of the easier ones to get into based on who I've seen in the group [no offense to any of them, as they're all still legit].)

-Adidas Movin' Shoes (Sandiego, CA ... some travel, some gear depending on how good you are, standards are definitely on the weaker side compared to some of these. Don't know much about them though and don't know if they even have a website. I just know a couple guys who are part of it.

-Georgetown Running Company (I think this one is all-comers pretty much, but the better you are the more you get maybe? I don't know, they definitely have at least a couple legit guys who train/race for them. Check their website.)

-Boston and New York Track Clubs. I see a ton of post-collegiate guys I used to race against running for either the Boston or NY track clubs. I have no idea what these groups are about if they're something social you join or if you qualify for them and then get stuff??? I haven't bothered to look into them because I don't want to live in NYC or Boston. I need trails.

Ok that's all I got. There has to be more out there. Like those NY ones I wouldn't even know about if I didn't know the guys on the team. So I assume there has to be other groups out there in other states like these I don't know about because I haven't heard of them through word of mouth. There realy should be a master list of all these somewhere.

Establishing a legit training group is easy to do. Finding funding--or even people who respect and believe in what you're trying to do--is the difficult part.

If you can find a group of guys with similar training and schedule structures, who are willing to grind it out with you, then you should jump on the opportunity. Unless you're a stud OR you know the right people, you're not going to get funded by a training group with ALL THE TOPPINGS...

If you are at the Trials level as a runner. HOUSING IS A MUST. Any developmental center that can not promise you that is trying to do things on the cheap.

FYI - Boston actually has a ton of trails and soft surfaces to run on w/in the city (emerald necklace, franklin park, the arb), and there's a ton of huge parks within a 10-15 minute drive. Of course you have to be willing to put up with snow for a few months.

I live in Jersey and run for the Garden State Track Club. We have a bunch of different training groups, including a track/sprint group, and I love it. We have scored well at the club championships in the fall and the spring, and we seem to have most of the state's best talent on the team.

What is the best group for a 13:45 guy not good to enough to get a shoe contract but could make any of these groups? I'd like to step up to the marathon by 2016.

No one has mentioned any of the Team USA groups except McMillan which is also Team USA Arizona. How good do you have to be to get in Team USA California or Team USA MN?

others include

Team USA MN - doesn't have housing, and I think you have to have your own shoe contract

Mammoth Track Club - not sure what they provide - Hall, Meb, and Cox have all run for them at some point or do currently

Steve Jones' group in Boulder - fuzzy on this

The Boston clubs are:

New Balance Boston

Boston Athletics Association

Greater Boston Track Club

I think at most they provide travel and gear, but I could be wrong.

Pacers Group in Northern VA - supposedly provides housing and a stipend, but I don't know much about it - Centrowitz is the coach

Ragged Mountain Racing team in Charlottesville - only provides a stipend according to their website

Atlanta Track Club - provides gear and travel

Boulder Running Company Team - did pretty well at club xc nats

Team Rogue Elite - in Austin, TX - Steve Sisson is the coach, don't know what they provide, but they're sponsored by Under Armor

Oregon Track Club Elite - no idea of the standards to get in

Oregon Distance Project - no idea of the standards to get in

"-Stotan Racing (Syracuse, NY ... not sure what they give you, but they have a lot of guys in the 30minute range for 10k, 67 minute range for half marathon. They're best guy is an OT Marathon qualifier. Coached by Coach Aris, the coach for FM high school. I would have thought about joinging this group except I've heard their training is pretty crazy out there and most people get hurt. Well, they get good if they stay healthy/don't burn out I guess.)"

For what they give you:

http://stotanracing.com/index.php/potential-athletes/

Re "They're best guy is an OT Marathon qualifier": Fred Joslyn tops their young marathon group, three or four guys who are training for the marathon (i.e. Mike Heymann 14:13 5k, 29:55 10k, 67:20 half). Distance, Brad Miller (13:57 5k, 4:00 mile), Colin Leak (13:53 5k, 65:30 half marathon, 44:40 @ Jacksonville 15k), Nick Stenuf (3:42 1500). On the women's side, Maegan Krifchin (71:04 half marathon, Nike Contract runner), Laurel Burdick, OT Marathon Qualifier, Leah Andrianos (4:22 1500).

Re "most people get hurt": I am on the team and aside from the rare one-two day rest for minor things, there have been no major injuries in more than a year. Coaching is on another level. Always ahead on everything.

Training Groups wrote:

This is what the REAL training centers take care of.

FREE HOUSING

FREE TRAVEL

FREE COACHING

FREE EQUIPMENT

FREE HEALTH INSURANCE

FREE MASSAGE

FREE PHYSICAL THERAPY

Any thing less than this is only a group of runners running together.

Which I think narrows it down to only Mammoth Lakes and Nike's select few in Eugene.

Don't know that there's anything wrong with a group of runners running together. If they're well-coached and able to feed themselves, and they work hard and have big goals, sometimes amazing things happen. Isn't that the American Dream, running-style?