Are there any successful hs level programs that get major results off of under 30 mpw for the totality of training year round? And if so, what do they do to be so successful?
Are there any successful hs level programs that get major results off of under 30 mpw for the totality of training year round? And if so, what do they do to be so successful?
thomthumb wrote:
Are there any successful hs level programs that get major results off of under 30 mpw for the totality of training year round?
No.
extremely dumb question wrote:
thomthumb wrote:Are there any successful hs level programs that get major results off of under 30 mpw for the totality of training year round?
No.
I'll second that...
Low mileage for high school is 50 • 60 miles a week
The best that I've heard from an ultra-low mileage program (though to be honest, I don't know the vast majority of training programs around the nation so there is likely to be an even better example than this) is a team that made it to state in Washington's biggest class (one of the tougher, though not the toughest, state races in the nation) and finished 10th in 2007... I think they ran under 20 mpw even. They aren't a consistent state qualifier, though: that was the only boys team they qualified for state in the last decade, and they haven't qualified any girls team to state in the last decade, though they have qualified several individuals on both sides.
please!!!! wrote:
I'll second that...
Low mileage for high school is 50 • 60 miles a week
That's total crap. Maybe the best kid on the team is running that much. While we haven't many male standouts from my area, the best run between 50-70 miles per week. They top off around mid 15's for 5k. It's common and fairly easy to run 17:30 (not incredible I know) and faster on 30-40 per week, and I know that is what most kids run.
East kentwood in michigan. Off that milage or less you can be great, but will need to run more to be successfull there and be running the 1 and 2 mile.
what about Stillwater, Minnesota? What type of mileage do they run?
My guess is that the lowest mileage programs that are consistently successful run in the 30 mpw range. That would be the lowest. Its hard to imagine a team being successful (unless they just had a ton of natural talent) averaging less than 5 miles per day for 6 days a week.
I know of a state championship team that didn't do dick during the season and the guys all played basketball and soccer over the summer. During the season they were probably at around 20-25 miles per week. They pulled it off because they had super talent and it was kind of a down year in a state that already doesn't have great competition.
I agree with this.
My high school program topped off around 30 and my junior year we had 5 guys under 17:30; I was the only one doing more than 25-30mpw all season.
Bryan Berryhill once said in an interview that in h.s his junior year he ran something like 8 (yes, eight)mpw. He twice won 400m/800m double at State Meet. I suspect he was lowballing his training in the interview, but even if he ran three times what he stated...But then, he had 48-49 speed in h.s. Different kids respond well to different volumes and intensities. There are probably lots of 60mpw programs out there that are NOT successful, simply because that is too much for the specific kids involved.
It's not "Sixty is the magic number, and if I get all my kids to run that, we'll be great," but rather it bodes well for your success if you happen to gather a bunch of kids who just happen to be able to handle 60mpw. But those same kids would likely be great at 50.
I think it depends on how you define "successful". Success in terms of NXN? Successful in terms of success at all state or all league meets?
You would be surprised how many teams run around 30-35 miles per week and do relatively well in their respective leagues, divisions, etc..I'm thinking New England Prep Schools for example.
These teams switch their training from mileage to speed work almost immediately once school starts.
But those schools, and their respective teams and champion runners wouldn't even place in the better state meets in tri state area (NY/NJ/CT), California, or the midwest.
From what I read...everyone agres that no "program" has trained that low, but super talent can get away with it. Some people/coaches do not count garbage miles as training.
Time on your feet is time on your feet.
One could do a program that low, but it would take more time a lot of cross training...High school coaches already make 50 cent an hour...I don't think any coaches want to double the effort/time involved to prove it can be done.
I don't trust you wrote:
please!!!! wrote:I'll second that...
Low mileage for high school is 50 • 60 miles a week
That's total crap. Maybe the best kid on the team is running that much. While we haven't many male standouts from my area, the best run between 50-70 miles per week. They top off around mid 15's for 5k. It's common and fairly easy to run 17:30 (not incredible I know) and faster on 30-40 per week, and I know that is what most kids run.
You provide my point didn't you....
Its almost impossible to have a successful program off of running only 30 miles a week.
The OP didn't ask what was common. He asked about successful programs. I hate to break it to you but 17:30 runners don't make the top 10 on successful teams.
The state I coach in. You have to average at least a 16:30 team time to even think of qualifying for the state meet. One region you had to average a 16:10 to qualify as the fourth team in the region.
Your most consistently successful teams in the country have 10-15 guys averaging between 50-60 miles a week if not more.
So to answer the OP questions there are almost no consistently successful teams that average 30 MPW of running.
I still don't think 50-60 miles is that much. That's about 75 minutes of running a day. Most high school kids if coached right should be able to do that by their senior year.
I am a female distance runner. In high school my cross country coach had us run about 3-4 miles per day (5 days a week). We would run along a canal and do an out and back run. He threw in the occasional hill workout but beyond that our runs were pretty basic. At the end of my senior year I was running 18:00 per 3 mile races and an 18:33 5k. In track we had the same coach. Again, our distance program was very basic. We did out and back runs along the canal and some track workouts (400 and 800 repeats). By the end of the track season I was running 5:00 1600. In college I was running 40-50 miles per week and found that I was thoroughly fatigued and did not perform much better at a higher weekly mileage, much to my surprise! To this day I consider myself a low mileage runner.
Runnnnnn wrote:
I am a female distance runner. In high school my cross country coach had us run about 3-4 miles per day (5 days a week). We would run along a canal and do an out and back run. He threw in the occasional hill workout but beyond that our runs were pretty basic. At the end of my senior year I was running 18:00 per 3 mile races and an 18:33 5k. In track we had the same coach. Again, our distance program was very basic. We did out and back runs along the canal and some track workouts (400 and 800 repeats). By the end of the track season I was running 5:00 1600. In college I was running 40-50 miles per week and found that I was thoroughly fatigued and did not perform much better at a higher weekly mileage, much to my surprise! To this day I consider myself a low mileage runner.
Aaaaaand this is why women's running is not as competitive.
fdfaldkjf wrote:
Runnnnnn wrote:I am a female distance runner. In high school my cross country coach had us run about 3-4 miles per day (5 days a week). We would run along a canal and do an out and back run. He threw in the occasional hill workout but beyond that our runs were pretty basic. At the end of my senior year I was running 18:00 per 3 mile races and an 18:33 5k. In track we had the same coach. Again, our distance program was very basic. We did out and back runs along the canal and some track workouts (400 and 800 repeats). By the end of the track season I was running 5:00 1600. In college I was running 40-50 miles per week and found that I was thoroughly fatigued and did not perform much better at a higher weekly mileage, much to my surprise! To this day I consider myself a low mileage runner.
Aaaaaand this is why women's running is not as competitive.
Come back when you manage to break 18 for the 5k.
Yep
I didn't do a long run but this got me to sub-2 for the 800m and 50. for the 400. Never ran the mile seriously but I think it got me a 4.30 mile?
Monday - 2 sets of 5x200m with wb recovery
Wednesday - 5 x 300m w/5 min recovery working down to 2 min
Thursday - 600s but never did them because I didn't feel like it.
Wharton High School in Tampa FL had some successful teams off lower mileage. Recently they havent been as good. We placed top 10 in state xc and as high as 2nd place in track while I was there.
When I ran there around during some of our best years a typical week looked like
M - 7 mile run
T - Warmup/Cooldown then track workout 10x400, 5x1k
W - 3 mile run and/or plyometrics/general strength exercises
T - Warmup/Cooldown track workout 400s, 1ks, 200s
F - Warmup/Cooldown 400 @ race pace
S - Race or Long Run 8 miles
S - Rest
Weekly total 20 - 35 miles max
This is what our top 5 xc guys ran off this training
1-4:16,9:36,15:54
2-4:30,9:58,17:00
3-4:40,10:10, 16:13
4-49, 1:56, 17:20
5- 4:50, 10:30, 17:30