Keys to Arkansas success in Mcdonnell era?

Well, I cannot give insights like the Arkansas alums that sometimes post here but a couple of observations.

1) the coach - both as coach and recruiter, presumably in all sorts of dimensions. My impression is he is well-liked by athletes and by those close to them (families, etc)

2) the tradition starts to self-generate as top guys want to go to a successful program; see the thread on top programs

3) being able to recruit top foreign athletes while not being limited to them like some programs get.

4) remarkable balance because they dominated XC while dominating track, so that they had scholarships going to top TJ athletes, etc, etc. Dick Booth has to be given his due here (field/jumps coach)

5) probably institutional support. They have great indoor and outdoor facilities, have had a major XC invite etc.

6) the coach - see #1 for probably more reasons than I listed there

Arkansas guys, I would like to see your more informed and personal insights.

There have been a few threads about this before. If I remember correctly it was moderate mileage with a lot of intra-team racing in practice. Most weeks consisted of three sessions: long tempo, long intervals (that got shorter as the season progressed...2400m on down) and some short repeats (20 x 400 if I recall). Most guys say they just ran hard and had a lot of talent, but, the coach was also a genius at knowing when to push guys what ways and when to hold them back. Also could get them fired up pretty well if I remember correctly.

An incredible amount of work and Tyson chicken.

lots of kenyans and irishmen

Definitely NOT the facilities....they were only added at the end of the era. I'd say it was more like the 2 mile repeats on the the red dirt roads out by the hog farms 30 minutes from campus. Or the 1:05 12 milers every week. Or Seneca Lassiter running a 2:50 1200m at the start of a workout on a flat track, inside that tin shed with the old school space heaters hanging from the roof. Or the fact that Coach Mac got everyone to believe in themselves by putting the team first. Yeah, he had some foreign talent, but that guy could take any American and make 'em great. Developing every athlete at every talent level for so many years.....remarkable!!!

Not tolerating B.S. is the only thing I would add.

Desi O'Connor wrote:

Not tolerating B.S. is the only thing I would add.

Rod, you still owe me for the rooms you and your crew never paid for before the '96 games in Hattiesburg. Care to send me that check now? I could use it.

Joe Falcon was a local guy and one of the best of his era.

Mcdonnell was the key. He built that team with a combination of talented foreign 1500 guys from Canada, Ireland, and England, and hard nosed kids like Falcon and Reina who learned to keep up fast. And they had a very strong team identity. The team was always more important than the individual.

Other than Reina, most of the top American high school talents went elsewhere. McDonnell didn't spend the time ass kissing those kids. Most of his American guys were in the region.

And he obviously knew what he was doing with training.

Basically what I heard.

You get a lot of talented dedicated runners together, and train them hard and smart. Then you just let their natural competitiveness do the rest.

Plus, if you leave runners who didn't run fast enough for their long run at the trail ten miles from campus, that should start to motivate them.

THE LEADER.

#1. McDonnell. Treated men like horses. & they ran like horses.

THE PHILOSOPHY.

#2. Track FIRST mentality. This is key. McDonnell had slapdicks on books show up in XC & make a huge difference. This allowed for scholarships to go to the consistent high point scorers on the track: JUMPERS. Long/Triple is a money combination & Booth was/is the MASTER. Watch Alabama in the next few years.

#3. Team. Not the "no I in TEAM" attitude but the opposite. Rather, "If I don't step up someone else will." This is a very misunderstood concept that if managed (or manipulated) correctly can result in amazing feats of heroism.

#4. Doubling, or Avoid One-Eventers. Look at the results of all those NCAA Championships & you'll see warriors. Guys who were excepted to produce multiple scoring results. All Hogs Double. or Triple.

#5. Culture. Train hard; live hard. Wake up & do it again. Every damn day.

#6. Academics. Or the lack of...Schools was just an afterthought. These boys were athlete-students. Not that there weren't smart cats at Arkansas but that was not the focus. You were paid (or allowed to train)...with an education (& maybe other ways) to run. Period.

THE TRAINING.

#7. Survival of the Fittest. High intensity with moderate mileage & an earn your way policy that required either amazing talent, amazing resilience or an amazing ability to self-adjust to the environment. Johnny Mac KNEW who could handle the loads & rode them hard. VERY hard.

THE PROMISE.

#8. Professional Contract. Nuff said.

This is a great topic. There was another good thread on this topic a few months back but it would be great to get it going again. There were some great stories told!!

when a team says they train "hard", are they killing it every day, or just the 2 workouts and long run per week while taking easy days easy?

pigtail wrote:

when a team says they train "hard", are they killing it every day, or just the 2 workouts and long run per week while taking easy days easy?

Hard on the easy days (5:40-5:50 for the top 10) and crazy hard on the hard days (depended on distance - look at the links below). The 2:50 1200 from Lassiter was not the only event of its kind like that. These were thoroughbreds racing thoroughbreds. Think Secretariats all around.

This is one of the threads I believe was thought of earlier. Tons of details and hogs posting directly:

And another decent one pulled from within the thread listed above:

Use the custom Google search at the top of the forums on the right hand side. It will help narrow the search. The thread linked above is pretty informative, but, I know I've read 2 or 3 more from guys who used to run there.

Sounds like Villanova in the 1970's. Arkansas was always a mid-distance oriented program. Lower mileage and a lot of intensity. Only from what I've learned on here and from the Arkansas runners firsthand from the late '80s. And no matter what anyone says, 5:40 pace on a recovery day is quality. Quality every day.

The 9:00 kid with the 4:14 mile and 1:57 800 would have had a rough time in this program. I would imagine. Although there were guys like that that survived and filled in importantly on all those Cross Country Championships when the milers had an off day.

I would like to chime in about John McDonnell - I coached Falcon in hs and had some personal conversations with Coach Mc during Joe's frosh year. Joe came in after a very good summer of running and was highly motivated. John held him back when needed (Joe was over-anxious to contribute right away). The athletes had the utmost respect for John and would run through a wall for him!!!Joe may have put too much effort into the early season, but John knew how to force him to pace his workouts, etc. to be ready to help as the season progressed. His first inclination was to red-shirt Joe. He had a great group of experienced upper classman, but decided that Joe may be an important part of a team that could possibly win NCAA's. John was a superb motivator and knew how to handle the young athletes. At nationals (at Penn St.) John knew exactly what places they needed to win and was at the perfect location on the course to communicate that to his athletes. In the last mile Joe did what he had to, as he passed 10-20 runners to finish 24th and the Hogs won. (I believe Joe was 5th man that day). John was the best at taking the experienced international athlete or the local hs athlete and molding them into winners.

I've read through the old Arkansas threads, and if anyone wanted to emulate an "arkansas week" during cross, it'd look something like this:

m-mile repeats, very hard. ~3min rec.

t-weights + 8mi moderate to hard

w-400m repeats, very hard. ~1min rec?

t-weights + 8mi moderate to hard

f-pre-meet?

s-race

s-14mi long run, moderate to hard

Pretty simple. Not the greatest--definitely a "survival of the fittest" mentality. Not something that'd work on just any team. You gotta figure that J Mac only recruited guys he knew could handle it. Not too many razorbacks ran after college, probably because they were torched by the end of it. But hey, I would probably trade that for a triple crown ring or two...

Lassiter ever do anything post college?

asdfafasdfa wrote:

I've read through the old Arkansas threads, and if anyone wanted to emulate an "arkansas week" during cross, it'd look something like this:

m-mile repeats, very hard. ~3min rec.

t-weights + 8mi moderate to hard

w-400m repeats, very hard. ~1min rec?

t-weights + 8mi moderate to hard

f-pre-meet?

s-race

s-14mi long run, moderate to hard

Pretty simple. Not the greatest--definitely a "survival of the fittest" mentality. Not something that'd work on just any team. You gotta figure that J Mac only recruited guys he knew could handle it. Not too many razorbacks ran after college, probably because they were torched by the end of it. But hey, I would probably trade that for a triple crown ring or two...

That is the standard cross plan for a MD runner on the team. The LD guys did more volume b/c they could handle it. It is important to note that the program that O'mara did was different from the program that Falcon did, which was different from the program that Bruton/Hood did, which differed from the program that Cragg/Lincoln did. Got it? Don't forget 4 days a week of morning runs of 4-5 miles(6 at times for the LD guys). For the record, I did trade it in for three triple crown rings(11 championship teams total during my time), great times with the lads, and more than a few AA's thrown in for good measure.

P.S. All training is survival of the fittest. Proper hard training will find your weakness, be it physical or mental.