creatine question

I've found that creatine helps me recover and helps me add an extra rep or two to my lifts, which can make a big difference when trying to build muscle. It could just be the placebo effect, but either way, something about it works. Your muscles will also swell up a bit, which is always nice for the ladies. I don't see any problem with letting high school kids take it. It's legal in high school and NCAA sports, schools just can't give it to kids for liability purposes. The only piece of advice I'd give is to drink lots of water.

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I don't think it helps specifically with endurance or recovery from running. It does help with resistance training and building muscle. If your workouts involve weights, etc., it will probably help. If you're just running, biking, etc., it's probably a waste of money.

It doesn't build muscle, it allows your muscles to absorb more water, fill up. Takes water from your organs, mainly kidneys, too much creatine is dangerous.

One important tip for endurance athletes who use creatine is to take 3/4 to 1 tablespoon of glycerol with at least 16 oz of water a couple times a week.

This will prevent creatine dehydration and cramping.

Personally, I think the usual fear of gaining weight is what keeps most runners from using it.

I can't think of any reason a serious runner wouldn't use it when doing a period of speed work except for stomach issues (some people cramp, bloat).

Someone should just remarket it as a "blood volume expander" and make a mint of Triathletes.

Oh, ON Nutrition, or any creapure creatine monohydrate. Don't worry about loading. If you can stand the taste mess around with adding Creatine Ethyl Ester within 1/2 hour of workouts-- the CEE doesn't bloat you and despite studies that it breaks down into Creatinine in your stomach I think you'll find a noticeable energy/strength boost during workouts. You might even want to try 5mg 1 hour into your long runs; again, if you can stand the taste.

ice.. wrote:

It doesn't build muscle, it allows your muscles to absorb more water, fill up. Takes water from your organs, mainly kidneys, too much creatine is dangerous.

That's what I understand.

it doesn't help significantly with endurance exercise. what creatine does is saturate your muscles fibers and make them hold more water, but since they are bigger you appear slightly larger and you have slightly more strength, i could see how it could help get in a little extra power but it wont help at all with recovery because it has one purpose, to bring water into the muscles. if you want to recover faster get 2 things. get Whey protein and Casein Protein, take the whey within a half hour of a workout or any run and take the casein 20-30 minutes before bed. the casein breaks down slower and will get into your muscles all night helping to speed recovery with a constant supply of protein and the whey directly after your workout will get into muscles fast and get the recovery process started. you may also want to take BCAA's which will help give your body a more complete protein by replacing any missing amino acids.

I feel like I should try to set the record straight based on the currently-available EVIDENCE and not what some posters "feel" they get having done it or what they've "heard" from their local gym rat.

Let's start from the basics here. As we probably all know already, high-intensity, short duration (<15 s) work is achieved primarily via the ATP-CP system where Creatine (Cr) is broken down. During this work, muscle creatine stores can fall to <30% of initial concentrations (somewhere in the 75-85 mM/kg of dry muscle weight). So, the THEORY (yes, it's still very much a theory) is that exogenous Cr supplementation will increase the resevoir available for PCr splitting. The problem is that it is very likely there exists an upper limit of creatine storage (somewhere near the 85 mM/kg dry muscle).

Cr supplementation will NOT increase maximum speed or power! It will however increase speed MAINTENANCE, primarily by acting as a "buffer" for H+ from the PCr+ADP+H+ reaction to ATP+Cr.

It is not known whether increased Cr stores enhance recovery during repeated, high-intensity efforts, but my thoughts are that it probably does. With that said, recovery of PCr within the muscle is EXTREMELY rapid (95% replenished within 3 mins, without Cr supplementation), so that begs the question, is there really any need to supplment? Maybe if you were doing a series of high-intensity intervals where your recovery is <1 min (PCr recovery is "only" about 67% replenished within 60s).

With that said, here are the side effects:

1. Increased weight gain, within the first few days of supplementation. In sports where carrying your weight is of importance (almost all of them except for rowing and cycling on the level), this excess weight gan may be detrimental. Think of the force-power-velocity relationship people!!!

2. Many complain of tight or stiff muscles

3. With continued use of Cr supplementation, endogenous production of Cr by the liver and kidneys is down-regulated. While it APPEARS that endogenous production resumes after supplementation stops, there are really not enough good longitudinal studies out to confirm this

4. It MAY be stressful on your kidneys. Again, not enough really good longitudinal studies to confirm this one way or the other.

5. Athletes, particularly those who are already highly-trained, with a high percentage of Fast-twitch fibres may not see any performance gaines since their PCr concentrations will already be very high to begin with through years of training and/or a very high proportion of Type II fibres (which are able to store larger quantities of PCr).

6. Many coaches/athletes don't know how to properly cycle creatine to maximize the potential (albeit potentially limited) performance benefits. Maintenance phases often are not incorporated into the Cr loading and/or long term loading persists.

I hope that helps dispell some of the myths.

jT

I get a bit concerned with kids taking supplements (aside from something like a multi-vitamin).

The classic study that to me illustrates creatine's benefits is where college football players were in off season weight lifting. One group got creatine, the other did not. Neither side knew. The exp group was able to complete more reps, thus get a bigger training load and thus gained strength.

However, I think the drawback of the weight gain would be detrimental to endurance performance.

The excess weight gain is detrimental to ANY performance where you have to move that added mass. Weightlifting? great. You do more reps, you get stronger. Running a 400m? Good luck with 3 extra kilos on you!

yes and know:

If an athlete weighing 160 who has a max squat of say, 280, can run a 400 in say50, would it not be fair to say that an athlete 10lbs heavier, with a max squat double his body weight would be able to run a faster 400? Pound for pound the heavier athlete is much stronger and able to propell himself forward much further per stride than the first athlete. I've seen examples of this happening over a year period. Argue all you want, but you'll never convince me that a little mass is detremental as long as that mass comes with increased power.

of course, it's a fine line between added mass and "effective added mass" but I would suggest that too many coaches and athletes get it wrong most of the time, particularly with creatine. Creatine will NOT make you more powerful (particularly over the course of a 400m), since creatine supply is not limited, nor is it the major energy supply for the event. It MIGHT help you recover from many, very short (<15s) high-intensity exercise bouts, but it won't make you faster/stronger/faster over events longer than this.

There are no studies on the long term effects of taking creatine--to have kids take it is nuts--distance runners don't need it--so why should anyone take it except the brainless bodybuilder types who don't know shit? Why even mess with something like creatine that may have the potential of wrecking your kidneys down the road? I wonder if the JV kids are getting the muscle twitches that come from not drinking enough water while taking creatine?