Flanagan just outside of AR

rofl. not a solo effort she had people to chase. people far far ahead of her slow American ass.

mh wrote:

14:45.20, just missing Huddle's AR 14:44.76. A solo effort, as she was never with the rabbitted front group.

Why didn't she run with the group?

So the top 3 American times are

14:44.76 (huddle)

14:44.80 (flanny)

14:45.20 (flanny)

Why are they so clustered? Seems like that would be hard to do if Molly and Shalane had tried.

why the hate wrote:

What the hell is she doing in Oklahoma?

I LOVE THIS MESSAGEBOARD!!

why the hate wrote:

What the hell is she doing in Oklahoma?

She's looking for the rabbitted front group of course.

American distance runners are weak and think way too much during competition. Shalane Flanagan goal the AR and Amy Hastings sub 15:14 both of them just miss it by running too darn conservative.

When the hell are you gonna see Shalane put it on the line and go with the leaders, it's possible she may -or- may not blow up but she will never take that chance. She was a far back 10th with 1600m to go and end up 4 or 5th gaining on every except the two Ethiopians. Amy Hasting ran 15:14 last month and come here to go sub 15:14 so Angela could go to Worlds but Amy runs 15:15. Will she be able to look her teammate Angela Bizzarri in the eyes and truthfully say she gave it her best shot? Did she take a chance NO, did she compete NO, she ran like most American distance runners with their eyes on the watch and never in the game. Go out at 15:10 pace and give yourself cushion- forget it besides Bernard, Galen, Christin, Alyssa, and Lucas there aren't any take risk American distance runners.

If your gonna miss your goal do it because you pushed yourself to your limit trying to compete and not because you ran conservatively and was never really in the competition. What a patheic display they both should have stayed home.

She was at the 1600 in 4:42.xx while the leaders went through in about 4:40. Its not like she died or anything, meseret defar just had a 2000 meter kick.

She might have been that close at 1600m but by 3400m she was over 10 secs back- so in 1800m she lost 8 seconds and I don't think Meseret was kicking in the middle of the race. She was never in the competition and she didn't get the AR she might as well stayed home and watched Jay Leno.

OneTwoPunch wrote:

... she didn't get the AR she might as well stayed home and watched Jay Leno.

Now there is a genius quote. If she can't run faster than any other American woman in history, it isn't worth trying.

Le sigh.

Emotionally, many reading your post will want to believe that your argument makes sense but intellectually it's 100% crazy. As we said in our recap, this wasn't a good race for Hastings to be in.

Do you really think someone with a 15:14 pb should go at at 14:40 pace?

If I was coaching a walk-on at Cornell who was a 15:15 freshman, I would never tell someone to to go out in 4:42 - which is what Flanagan went out in and was dead last for the main pack.

That's justtoo fast. Anything faster than 4:45 is big, big trouble.

Take Galen Rupp for example. His pb is 13:07. Let's say he goes out for the 1600 on Sunday at a pace that is 34 seconds faster than his pb. Guess what his 1600 split would be?

??

??

go ahead and guess.

4:00.

That is called suicide.

OneTwoPunch is absolutely right.

I have nothing against either Shalane or Amy, but what's the point of going to Paris and getting into a race like that if you're not going to take at least somewhat of a risk and put it out there? If all you want to do is run a safe and conservative pace, then find a slower field to run with. If you get into a field like that, it should be to really test yourself and see what happens.

He's also (unfortunately) correct that too many Americans are too often just not willing to race and compete with guts and courage. It's a shame, not to mention a wasted opportunity.

Are you drunk or high? I said Shalane should have went the leaders not Amy Hastings. I clearly stated that Amy should have given herself some cushion and went out around 15:10, so please don't purposely mix my statements. Leave Galen Rupp out of this he's a male and where talking about the female women in Paris GP!

The bottom line is American no longer take risks and they instead run for time and most close extremely well- which would lead many to think what would have happened if they FINALLY took a risk and went out much faster. This a GP race not Worlds or Olympics, now is the time to take risk and see exactly where the athlete's stand. Shalane took no risk and most likely ended up with more questions then answers during that race.

I'm pretty sure Shalane would have known at the start she wasn't in 14:29 shape, but she might have been in 14:43 shape, so it looked like the right strategy to me.

OneTwoPunch wrote:

The bottom line is American no longer take risks and they instead run for time...

Chris Solinsky explicitly says that he runs to compete and win, not time. Amy Hastings is a B level pro and should of not been in the race. Chasing the standard in a 5k race is totally different from chasing the standard in a 1500, where if you are off the back its 3-5 seconds.

If you watched the race Flanagan was in the back of the main pack, which gave her a 2 to 3 sec per lap cushion over the leaders pace. Now what about the other ladies who went out with the leader, and only 2 could hang while the rest died.

She went to Paris to run fast, and that is what she did. If she would have been in the front and died you would be on here saying she ran a stupid race for going out too fast.

Once again it shows that this board, and its posters mainly made up of slower people are not truly supporting American distance runners.

How about this if you don't like the way the American's run, and don't want to support them then move out of the country. Go live in Ethopia and tell me how you like it.

Sir who got your $1 stockings in a bunch? It's a shame that Americans don't expect more out their distance track athletes who no longer run to compete.

I long for the days of Patti Sue Plummer who bit her lip til it bleed TRYING TO WIN or she routinely ran so hard she collapse at the finish. Or Lynn Jennings 3 time World Cross Champion add against Ethiopians and Kenyans. Vicki Huber who as a collegian took the lead in the 3000m Olympic final and tired to force the pace, she was dropped but SHE TIRED!!!!

SonOfACrackhead wrote:

Sir who got your $1 stockings in a bunch? It's a shame that Americans don't expect more out their distance track athletes who no longer run to compete.

I long for the days of Patti Sue Plummer who bit her lip til it bleed TRYING TO WIN or she routinely ran so hard she collapse at the finish. Or Lynn Jennings 3 time World Cross Champion add against Ethiopians and Kenyans. Vicki Huber who as a collegian took the lead in the 3000m Olympic final and tired to force the pace, she was dropped but SHE TIRED!!!!

so you wish shalane was more like people 15 to 45 seconds slower than her over 5000 meters?

thats wonky...

More like running ~ 4:03.7 for the first mile for Rupp using the same percentage using the two examples provided in your post. In prospective to your example it would be like Rupp blasting off at 12:36+ pace for the first 4 laps.

On the all-time list one hundred thirty five woman have run under 14:30 no American has gone sub 14:44. Not a lot of Americans sitting at the big girls table.

As for running in the lead pack in a timetrial type race like this was. It's a good plan if you are looking to get the AR at 3,000m.