Why Aren't Horses Getting Faster?

For the most part, track technology has not improved much - dirt or grass. Sure, advances have been made, and some track have actually gone synthetic to help prevent the catastrophic injuries.

Shoe technology - what are shoes?

I've been told by horse trainers here in FL (where a number of Derby horses and winners have come from) that thoroughbreds are SO bred for this type of racing, that essentially, you just go through sharpening in training. There are not all the years of base-building like in humans. It's BRED into them, essentially. You get them on the track and run through some fast race-prep type of work. I am greatly simplifying here, but basically the answer here is BREEDING. You can breed numerous generations of horses under one watchful knowledgeable eye and really hone the abilities of the horse to racing. Humans don't do this.

Is there improved technology and training methods?

I was amazed in talking to a top trainer a few years ago that the horses don't do anything that resembles workouts as we know them.

gambling fees pay for authentic detective grade cops to administer dope tests.

against the law for non-sworn police officers to touch a drug sample or to take a drug sample.

cops use parole officer rules for samples. my law they must see with their own eyey the urine flow into the cup. by law they must see the blood flow into the test tube.

state laws mandate jockeys, trainers, owners sign away constitutional rights to search and seizure of financial records, horses, jockeys, trainers, cars, homes, hotel rooms, stables, etc.

There isn't any incentive for them to get faster - take the Derby, if you win in 2:05 you get the same money as you would if you won in 1:59.

Athletics has made a point of giving incentives for WRs and time bonuses, horse racing hasn't.

The Stache wrote:

I've been told by horse trainers here in FL (where a number of Derby horses and winners have come from) that thoroughbreds are SO bred for this type of racing, that essentially, you just go through sharpening in training. There are not all the years of base-building like in humans. It's BRED into them, essentially. You get them on the track and run through some fast race-prep type of work. I am greatly simplifying here, but basically the answer here is BREEDING. You can breed numerous generations of horses under one watchful knowledgeable eye and really hone the abilities of the horse to racing. Humans don't do this.

Wow, is this for real? I don't care how strong their endurance is naturally, if they're not being trained, they are leaving a lot of fitness on the table. Sounds unlikely given all the money in the sport, right?

Lack of genetic diversity in the thoroughbred stock.

[quote]Total Knob wrote:

There isn't any incentive for them to get faster - take the Derby, if you win in 2:05 you get the same money as you would if you won in 1:59.

This is idiotic. If you run 2:05, you don't get any money if someone ELSE runs 1:59. That's the incentive to run faster.

Horses are much more prone to catastrophic, career-ending injuries (or even life-ending injuries). The best bred horses start out worth hundreds of thousands of dollars, and that number goes up quickly if they start winning early. Humans are more robust; we can come back from bad injuries. Racehorses are not very durable at all.

Owners of horses have big bucks invested and don't want injuries to jeopardize the potential earnings.

we need to bring in some East African horses.

Equipoise production has slipped over the past decade or so.

damnnnnnn wrote:

gambling fees pay for authentic detective grade cops to administer dope tests.

against the law for non-sworn police officers to touch a drug sample or to take a drug sample.

cops use parole officer rules for samples. my law they must see with their own eyey the urine flow into the cup. by law they must see the blood flow into the test tube.

state laws mandate jockeys, trainers, owners sign away constitutional rights to search and seizure of financial records, horses, jockeys, trainers, cars, homes, hotel rooms, stables, etc.

Doping control officers also witness the urine going into the cup and the blood into the vial.

I know you were joking, but thats a prime reason. Horse racing is tightly controlled. If you buy a horse just anywhere and its amazingly fast it can't race. You have to have its lineage documented.

Also The triple crown is for 3 year olds so there isn't much longterm training that can be done. I'm not positive but I think if they allowed in older horses the times would be slightly faster.

As others have said, exceedingly tight drug controls, it still happens, but the horse doesn't get banned, the owner/trainer does, and it can be for all of his horses.

If a trainer or coach were in running had a runner test positive and all of the runners in that training group were banned for a year we would see much less doping.

shawn wrote:

If a trainer or coach were in running had a runner test positive and all of the runners in that training group were banned for a year we would see much less training groups.

Fixed.

One main reason is of course that we're talking about horses not humans. Great racing horses are both physically gifted and have "alpha" personalities, i.e. they refuse to be in the back. Very few horses have both of these qualities, despite attempts to create them through breeding (only Risen Star was a truly successful offspring of Secretariat), and jockeys can only do so much considering they way 10% of the animal they are on top of. Additionally, as stated above many horses don't develop the ability to race until later in life, such as the legendary horse Cigar.

The group of horses that have broken 2:00 at the Derby is still a very small group, just Secretariat, his rival Sham, and Monarchos. Other than the Derby, Monarchos was not wildly successful (he only started 10 times).

The Stache wrote:

Humans don't do this.

Uh... ever hear of Steve and Shalane?

I think it comes down to self awareness. Horses may have an alpha mentality, but that is only with respect to the horses next to them. Humans can see times put up by others and strive to eclipse those times, where horses don't understand this. It could also back to some people's argument for East Africans, they are better because they have to excel at running to have a decent life, where Americans do it more as a hobby. There is no survival instinct involved in horses during races.

On that note, get a mountain lion to chase the horses from behind and I would almost guarantee a drop in times.

Humans care about time, and horses just "care" about being in the front. Do you think a horse knows if it is on world record pace? But with humans once a record is broken it makes everyone else feel that they are capable of more. Before 4 minute mile was broken other runners limited themselves. Once it was broken they realized that they should be capable of it too.

[quote]Total Knob wrote:

There isn't any incentive for them to get faster - take the Derby, if you win in 2:05 you get the same money as you would if you won in 1:59.

Hey? You would win if had another horse who ran faster

I also don't understand how you could not train them more endurance wise and get improved results. Having said that most of the races are a sprint for the horses

Serious follow-up question: Has anyone experimented with horses doing hill training? If it works for humans who will be racing on the flat, why not for horses?