all-American awards beyond top 8 are a joke?

America is in decline in everything. Get use to it.

Look at the Lord of the Rings film. That was entirely a foreign project. US distance is just reflecting America's overall cultural decline.

That is how Track and Field and XC have always worked--give ribbons or awards to almost all finishers so that they can keep that high self esteem and protect their fragile egos even if they suck.

You make it sounds like everyone gets to go to nationals.

Will 5 minute milers now be getting ribbons. Sign me up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Top 8 "Americans" are All "American." What's the problem? I don't see where being the 8th best runner in a population of 285 million is giving ribbons to everyone. Heck, I'd give anything to suck as bad as the 8th best in America.

Re: Americans behind the rest of the world. Could you please clarify what this means. Is this in all categories or just in distance running...or is that just men's distance running? Also, what do you mean by the rest of the world? Is America THE slowest country, or are their maybe at least a few countries...or even many that America might be faster than? Please back this up with data.

well, you can look at the results and compile a list of countries that are sending college athletes over here that are faster than "our" kids. so there is the data. are there countries that are slower than us, there sure are - but celebrating that fact is as ridiculous as giving the AA cert. to the kid who finishes 13th in the mile. are we better than other countries in other areas other than distance running, yep! we are one of the best countries in obesity, shipping jobs to foreign countries, basketball, and so on and so on. i just thought the main topic of conversation on letsrun.com was distance running... so, i was talking about distance running. go run, beat the foreigners, finish in the top eight, get your certificate!!! or run as hard as you can, finish 13th, and hang your certificate on the wall in your dorm room. i'm just saying that i think giving awards to anyone who finishes outside of the top 8 is wrong. it should be harder to get the award as the level of foreign competition improves each year.

Why should it be harder to earn an ALL-AMERICAN certificate just because the FOREIGN competition is tougher? That would be like making it harder to earn all conference honors in one conference just because another conference is stronger.

right, it is harder to earn all-conference in the stronger conference .... maybe you would like to expand all-conference honors to 15th place in that conference? i don't understand you point.

All-American means just that. Just because many of the best distance runners in the world come here and are allowed to compete in our collegiate national championship doesn't change the definition of who is "America's best".

You may be unhappy with what they run, jump or throw but they are still America's best.

It might lend more credence to your argument if you let us know when you were an all-american and under what circumstances you made it.

rather than contributing to a discussion on a topic on which you have a different opinion, you turn things into a personal attack. do you have to be an all-American to have an opinion on the subject. i am not sure who i am going to vote for during the presidential election this year. i have some opinions on a variety of different political topics, maybe i shouldn't express them in the voting booth because i have never held public office?

i've never been all-American, my running career ended early due to medical mistakes and serious injury. had it not, i would still have been a long way from AA. i am happy that i still get to be involved in the sport that i love. i have similar opinions as wetmore on the foreign athletes that are "stealing" public tax money from American kids. i wish there were more Americans finishing in the top 8 of events. i am happy to see American kids running fast no matter what position they finish in a race. i hope that one day more of "our" kids are up front. there seems to be a resurgence of distance running in our country. the women are closing the gap a bit faster, but there are some good solid you guys out there too. all i was doing was starting a conversation... if you were an AA and finished outside of the top 8 and i insulted you - that was not my intention. trophies, medals, and certificates are made for runner's attics unless they are vain. it is the experience / process that should mean the most. the race is truly against the clock in the end. if you finish 13th in the field and you have run as fast as you can, no matter what country you are from you have done your best.

so what you're saying is... you suck and have no right to talk shit about "all-americans," and were too stupid to know the rules of what it takes to be an "all-american" in the first place

just 2b checking

I somewhat see your point, but the award is called "All AMERICAN". If it was called All NCAA, that would be different, but by definition, it is the top 8 Americans in the race.

very mature response! yep, i suck because i didn't make AA. in fact, everyone that doesn't make AA sucks, why are 1000s of these people wasting their time running and training? i think that i do know what AA means if you read my first post, just asked if their is such a thing as "going back too far" to hand out the award. don't get your personal attacks, i haven't attacked anyone.

actually, the awards are for the "All-America" team

doesn't mean you have to be American to get them

I was an All American, outdoors a couple years back and was 6th overall in my event. I got an All-American certificate which I treasure and it was the highlight of my collegiate career. The only thing that bothers me about handing out certificates to people who place 13th is now because of the regional system there are some people who make it to ncaa's outdoors who would never have made it in the past. I think the races last year were some of the finest and everyone who deserved to go got there, but more people are going to the meet now. What happens when everyone in an event gets a certificate because so many foriegn athletes run? What if it's a guy who somehow got in with a 14:55 5k, or something. Then how would you all feel? Also they should change how they do the certificates because the foriegn athletes who get top 8 also get certificates so basically everyone in the top 8 plus the top 8 Americans, that just doesn't seem right either.

there are plenty of reasons you suck aside from not having been AA, sancho - in fact that isn't one of them. but since you queried, in your case, God clearly went "back too far" in handing out the "award," by which i mean a brain, when surely the stem would have sufficed.

nightmare wrote:

America is in decline in everything. Get use to it.

Look at the Lord of the Rings film. That was entirely a foreign project. US distance is just reflecting America's overall cultural decline.

that's the worst analogy or form of proof i have ever seen in my entire life. how can you possibly link the filming of a foreign movie in a foreign country to the decline of America?

back in the 70s and 80s when the foreign seen was not as large it made since to give AA to the top 8 americans (which would of been 9th or 10th place) but know with the large number of foreign athletes it is getting a little rediculous. D1 should do it like D2 and give AA to the foreign Athletes as well. Maybe they should get rid of the title All American and just give awards to the top 8 at Nationals.

i have a question. in the men's 800, kirk i believe it was false started. does he still considered all-american? given there was 8 people in the final and he false started