John Kellogg says something in his training wisdom like: "I once wrote the a football player could train himself to run balls-out QTR's and still not be in SHAPE. being IN SHAPE means being able to run continuously for 5-10 miles at a very high percentage of top speed."
just wondering what he means by this, it sounds like a cool quote but obviously not sure if it applies to athletes in other sports...
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I think like alot of the "old school" milers used to do- occasional good hard runs over 10 miles. Walker used to say that he was ready to run when he was doing his 10 miler under 50 minutes. Coe unofficially broke the then 10 mile wr over his hard 10 miler. Steve Scott would rip a 10 miler intermittently in his training. Mcdonnell was big on a hard 10 miler.
You could add Steve Cram to that list. And El Guerrouj was observed running 10 miles, in under 50 minutes, at altitude....for five days in a row.
Now let's see ANY of them defend Randy Moss.
Craig Masback, who apparently trained by doing nothing but 400's, at least in high school, would have kicked John Kellogg's butt 10 times out of 10.
Super swede wrote:
Coe unofficially broke the then 10 mile wr over his hard 10 miler. .
This is utter bunk. That rumor comes from Coe's biography when he writes he did a hard ten mile run "down near three-quarters of an hour."
Immediately on reading that, a bunch of half-literate track nerds started jumping up and down and losing bowel control shouting, "Coe ran a certified ten-mile course in 45:00.00 FAT once a week!"
Hard ten milers are great, and I'm sure Coe ran his fair share of them. . . but I doubt very much an oft-misunderstood quote accurately represents his performance over 10 miles.
Interesting quote, have seen it before and wondered how high a percentage he is refferring to.
Some of the elite milers mentioned above maybe had 100m sprinting speed of around 11.5. Being able to do a comfortably hard 10 miler doing roughly 18.5 secs per 100m (sub-50:00) is about 62% slower than 11.5 second 100m sprinting speed.
Does he mean that the football/bball/baseball players and underArmour wearing types are not in shape regardless of how many balls out quarters they do? Same with the crossfit/p90X crowd?
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Super swede wrote:
Coe unofficially broke the then 10 mile wr over his hard 10 miler. .
please make fine distinctions wrote:[/b
This is utter bunk. That rumor comes from Coe's biography when he writes he did a hard ten mile run "down near three-quarters of an hour."
The original description was from an article (SI?) and was in winter, Peter Coe following in a car behind his son, and the author of the article in the car.
They finish the run in "45 minutes" and the car odometer says 10,0
SC comments, "...that was good". The article then goes on to say the WR at the time was 46:xx.
They also did 10x880y in <2:00 w/ 60, on the road. Was it EXACTLY 880? Who cares...
The point is, he was in shape to run well under 50. And that was one of many benchmarks they used, some of which were quite modest (e.g. <8:00 for 3k indoors).
Off the Grid wrote:
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Super swede wrote:Coe unofficially broke the then 10 mile wr over his hard 10 miler. .
please make fine distinctions wrote:[/b
This is utter bunk. That rumor comes from Coe's biography when he writes he did a hard ten mile run "down near three-quarters of an hour."
The original description was from an article (SI?) and was in winter, Peter Coe following in a car behind his son, and the author of the article in the car.
They finish the run in "45 minutes" and the car odometer says 10,0
SC comments, "...that was good". The article then goes on to say the WR at the time was 46:xx.
They also did 10x880y in <2:00 w/ 60, on the road. Was it EXACTLY 880? Who cares...
The point is, he was in shape to run well under 50. And that was one of many benchmarks they used, some of which were quite modest (e.g. <8:00 for 3k indoors).
I want to see a link or something to that article. I have seen so many examples of people quoting articles etc. from memory: "runner x ran y time in a workout". Later you will read how someone quotes the same article from memory, and suddenly the same workout is somewhat faster and so the legend grows.
the 10x880 workout was part of the documentary on youtube
the 10 miler might have been in a serialized format from the book "Born to Run". I never owned the book, but I seem to recall borrowing it from a friend and reading it.
There were other anecdotes about how he fell asleep before the EJr 1500 in Greece, woke up 20 mins b4 the start, and got 3rd.
I remember 10 miler passage very clearly. It then went on to describe the rest of his family, and how his sister Miranda thought athletics was a bit too all consuming.
This was +25yrs ago, and I have not seen the book/article since. After writing this, I've been looking for the article and/or parts. If I find I will post.
Vroom Vrrroom wrote:
John Kellogg says something in his training wisdom like: "I once wrote the a football player could train himself to run balls-out QTR's and still not be in SHAPE. being IN SHAPE means being able to run continuously for 5-10 miles at a very high percentage of top speed."
just wondering what he means by this, it sounds like a cool quote but obviously not sure if it applies to athletes in other sports...
In college, my coach, who was essentially a student of Oregon training, had us alternate a xc race with a 10 miler at a hard pace. He called it a "power run."