This guy trained in the states under his Brazilian coach who coached many after.
THerefore,someone must know the training they did!!!
This guy trained in the states under his Brazilian coach who coached many after.
THerefore,someone must know the training they did!!!
hard 11 mile runs at 5:20 pace in the base phase (singles, every day)
progressing to doing every other mile in 4:40
progressing to doing 100m repeats while holding breath.
others tuff too but I don't remember (check the sub 1:50 800m training thread or, i don't know, google it?
Topped out at about 70 miles a week, most of it pretty quick, around 5:20 pace. He obviously ran very well and got the gold in LA and that's the most important part, but he wasn't quicker than Coe over 400m, so he should have been able to achieve much better times over 1500m.
I've got a copy of every track work out he did in his 1988 season at home. I'm not back for a few days and will post it up then. I've also got Barbosa's from 1991 when he ran his 1:43.08 PR.
Note that Cruz's list 400m PR is from when he was 17 years old, so I wouldn't really say that he had less speed than Coe. I think he would have run high 45 to low 46 at his peak.
Too much obsessive mileage talk in this thread (JRinaldi excepted). Cruz probably never approached a single 70 mile week in his life, but the pace of those miles in base phase (~5:20) is important and about what the Africans are doing now (see the Canova thread).This is from Track Technique (pp.3319-3333) for the 1990 season:
De Oliveira has coached Joaquim Cruz, Jose Luis Barbosa and Agberto Guymaraes who had between them collectively run 47 x sub-1.46, 15 x sub-1.45, 7 x sub-1.44, 5 x sub-1.43, and 1 x sub-1.42.
De Oliveira states that he never has these three athletes on the track at the same time, since they will compete with each other. He states that he also does this to get the athletes used to leading (his runners often run/win from the front). "You’ve got to learn how to do things on your own. You want to have people learn how to lead. You develop courage and confidence with this kind of training. If athletes just learn how to follow, they’ll always follow and never try hard."
He writes each athlete’s program only for the next week, based on: the year plan, and what the athlete did the previous week. He is willing to change the program if the athlete is not feeling good, and would even change things in the middle of a workout... but is careful how to do this for psychological reasons.
He used to wait till Feb to start doing speed, but found that being away from it so long could cause soreness at first. So he introduced circuit training during the winter with the athletes doing fast, but not all-out 50-metre runs. He also uses what he calls, "holding-breath running" in winter. The athletes run 50-75m holding their breath. Although he does not say how many repeats they run, or with what recovery, he believes this helps prepare them for the real speed training which still begins in Feb.
Interval training
When Cruz ran 3 x 1.42 one year, he was "going thru 700m in 1.28 and 1.29 and running the second lap three seconds slower than the first. The plan was to get him to where he could go thru in 1.27".
Here are the sessions he did before the 3 x 1.42s
Dec
5 sets of (5 x 400m in 66-68 av: 65 with 45 secs recovery and 4.00 mins between sets)
Feb
4 sets of (4 x 400m in 61-63 av:62 with 45 rec and 4.00 mins between sets)
Apr
3 sets of (4 x 400m in 58-60 av:58 with 60 secs rec)
June
3 sets of (3 x 400m in 56-58 av:57 with 60 rec)
Aug
2 sets of (2 x 400m in 51-53 av:51 with 3.00 mins rec)
So that no-one gets the idea it’s all 400m training, note that sessions such as: 6 x 1,000m in 2.35-2.40 (with 3.00 recovery) and 6 miles at 5.30-5.40m/m were being done in the Specific Prep (Apr-June) period.
The program alternates between hard and easy weeks, allowing every third Sunday as a day off.
Hill training
They do 800m repeats on a 15% hill (not steeper). About 6-8 x 800m depending on the athlete (no times given). Easy jog down recovery. They later do hill work on 300m, 200m, 100m and even 75m for speed workouts. For the shortest repeats they work on arm and knee lift, trying to improve coordination. They do no downhill training, fearing injury.
Plyometrics
Are done on grass in base training. They are then stopped, but they do retain "high knees" and "fast feet" sessions. He warns that they are hard on the knees and that they sometimes have to stop what is a very good exercise because of potential injury.
Pool training
De Oliveira started to use the pool for people who were injured, then decided to retain it as an integral part of the program. About 20% of training is in the pool.
There are a number of example weeks from de Oliveira’s training program, weekly mileage is as follows (incl warm-up and cool down):
• Basic preparation (Dec-March) approx 48-63 mpw
• Specific Prep (Apr-June) approx 60 mpw
• Competitive period (Jul-Sept) approx 39mpw
Coach D wrote:
Too much obsessive mileage talk in this thread (JRinaldi excepted). Cruz probably never approached a single 70 mile week in his life, but the pace of those miles in base phase (~5:20) is important and about what the Africans are doing now (see the Canova thread).
This is from Track Technique (pp.3319-3333) for the 1990 season:
11X7=77...,and he probably did 3-5 mile recovery jogs like coe did, and didn't count that.
Even so, 63-which YOU quoted-is certainly approaching 70, and I am SURE he was over 70mpw at least ONCE in his career.
this is great stuff because he is the number 1 800m runner in my mind.
good information and it has the correct spelling of Joaquim's name. What the heck is Joachim anyway? It's the same as calling Ryan Hall, Rian Hall
Watch it, buddy.
Joaquim Fan wrote:
good information and it has the correct spelling of Joaquim's name. What the heck is Joachim anyway? It's the same as calling Ryan Hall, Rian Hall
his name is Joachim Cruz. look it up
jcruzing wrote:
this is great stuff because he is the number 1 800m runner in my mind.
this is great stuff because he is the number 1 800m runner in my mind for saying on TV FloJo looked like a man and Jackie Joyner-Kersee looked like a gorilla.
(in a related note RW magazine quoted FloJo after the Rome WC that she was using Ben Johnson's weight training program)
You look it up Turd! I'll make it easy for you...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joaquim_Cruz
sure, i'm the slow...you are a turd. I'm from Brazil and from Brasilia, the same city he's from. Apart from being a national hero that every kid from my generation adored he is a runner which is the sport i love and follow and i would know better to write something in this board without being absolutely sure. Pronto!!
Coach D wrote:
Too much obsessive mileage talk in this thread (JRinaldi excepted). Cruz probably never approached a single 70 mile week in his life, but the pace of those miles in base phase (~5:20) is important and about what the Africans are doing now (see the Canova thread).
Not sure if you mean all African runners or just the 800-meter specialists, but either way that is a huge generalization.
If the majority of the African distance runners DID run 5:20 (even as an easy pace) it would not surprise me as the top-50 or so run the 5k at 4:10 per mile and have been for nearly 20 years. 5:20 pace is not hard for that level of runner. Not even for 10 miles.
I never said that he had less speed than Coe, just that he wasn't any faster. I thought his official best was in the mid 46s, but I've seen it cited as 46.00 in some places.As far as mileage, you need pipes and a shitload of mitochondria to produce all that energy in those last 200m, and most of that is not going to come from anaerobic respiration. You can plow through guys with great speed, looking for those few that have naturally high numbers, or you can lay down sufficient aerobic foundations and get them better across all distances.
JRinaldi wrote:
I've got a copy of every track work out he did in his 1988 season at home. I'm not back for a few days and will post it up then. I've also got Barbosa's from 1991 when he ran his 1:43.08 PR.
Note that Cruz's list 400m PR is from when he was 17 years old, so I wouldn't really say that he had less speed than Coe. I think he would have run high 45 to low 46 at his peak.
JRinaldi
Where is the info??
Can't wait
Just flew fron LA back to Australia today...will have a rest and post some stuff up soon.
darkness wrote:
Not sure if you mean all African runners or just the 800-meter specialists, but either way that is a huge generalization.
If the majority of the African distance runners DID run 5:20 (even as an easy pace) it would not surprise me as the top-50 or so run the 5k at 4:10 per mile and have been for nearly 20 years. 5:20 pace is not hard for that level of runner. Not even for 10 miles.
I meant All Africa Runners. This is what I'm getting at. From the most recent Renato Canova thread:
800m :
Duration 20' - 40'.
Speed : 1,4 - 1,5 slower than the Race Pace (RP)
Examples : Athlete 1'44" (RP 13" per 100m) : 18"2 - 19"5 per 100m (3'02" - 3'15" / km)
Athlete 2' (RP 15") : 21" - 22"5 (3'30" - 3'45")
1500m :
Duration 30' - 50'
Speed : 1,3 - 1,4 slower than RP
Examples : AT 3'30" (RP 14") : 18"2 - 19"6 (3'02" - 3'16")
AT 4' (RP 16") : 20"8 - 22"4 (3'28" - 3'44")
5000m :
Duration 45' - 1:10
Speed : 1,15 - 1,25 slower than RP
Examples : AT 13' (RP 15"6) : 17"9 - 19"5 (2'59" - 3'15")
AT 15' (RP 18") : 20"7 - 22"5 (3'27" - 3'45")
10000m :
Duration 1 hr - 1 hr30'
Speed : 1,15 - 1,25 slower than RP
Examples : AT 26'40" (RP 16") : 18"4 - 20" (3'04" -3'20")
AT 32' (RP 19"2) : 22" - 24" (3'40" - 4')
If you do the math, he would have, say, Rupp running AEROBIC ENDURANCE at roughly 5:15 speed to train for 10000. No, that's not a misprint. And 800/1500 would be going faster, as El Guerrouj did (~5:00 pace for 10 miles).
Coach D wrote:
And 800/1500 would be going faster, as El Guerrouj did (~5:00 pace for 10 miles).
at altitude, 5 days in a row. In fact, google "el guerrouj training" and the main article that comes up has aerobic endurance as...
Aerobic endurance is of four types:
1) 30-45 min of continuous running
2) 50-60 min of continuous running
For this workout there are no pre-set conditions, he is not asked any specific pace. However, he is demanded that he runs at his maximum at that moment, this varies from day to day and has nothing to do with the season. So, this means that El Guerrouj can run one day between 3:00-3:10/km pace and sometimes at 2:50/km.
3) 4 x 2000 m in 5:10 with 2 min recovery
4) 6 x 1000 m in 2:30 with 2 min recovery
and he does this at least 5-6 times a week in the morning, often with a strength/power/speed workout in the afternoon or simply more endurance...incredible!
Top middle distance runners have very little recovery jogging above 6 minutes/mile...but a lot between 4:40-5:20 (7-12 miles)-that is the sweet spot for endurance.
Canova's guys here are running 9 minutes a mile.
from what i have experienced a lot of these boys do a lot of their easy runs redicously easy. The kenyans crawl, ive heard so do the ethiopians and read moo9ttram does the same. Mo farah does also. easy days are meant to be and hard days are meant to be hard!!