Treadmills versus Road Running

Outside of the psychology of it (some prefer the 'mill, some not), I understand that the major items of concern are the lack of force produced by movement through the air (making the 'mill easier) and the fact that without a fan, the air on the 'mill is stagnant, thus yielding a higher surrounding temp for the runner. I believe that the general rule of thumb is set the 'mill for a 1 to 2% incline to compensate for the lack of wind resistance, assuming that you're also using a fan. My personal experience is that on a calibrated treadmill, a grade of around 1.5% correlates very well to over-ground effort. That is, if I do a workout on that 'mill, I can expect to have similar effort on a track, using the same target times/distances.

The one nice aspect of treadmill training is that you can do hill repeats without ever having to do a downhill while having precise control over recovery time. Interestingly, the weather was quite bad here yesterday, so I did a VO2max style workout on my treadmill I call "trades". Basically, I alternate repeats where the the odds are hill-based and the evens aren't (e.g., rotating 6:00 pace on a 5% hill vs. 5:30 on the flat). The efforts are keyed to be the same, but the muscles are worked a little differently. Helps reduce the boredom factor. Treadmill workouts may not be identical to road running, but the way I figure it, the quality of that 'mill workout was higher than what I would've received in the freezing rain.

dude, treadmills are far harder to run on, especially for taller/faster runners. you can't properly stride on them. the roads are much easier to produce times on.

I can run a sub-6 minute mile pretty easily, nothing to brag about, on the road; however, it seems quite difficult to run a 6 minute mile on the treadmill.

That being said, I can run longer on the treadmill at a slow pace than on the roads. I do many long runs on the treadmill.

10k Runner wrote:

Which is easier to produce faster times on?? Running on a treadmill for 5 miles (no incline) or running on a straight road for 5 miles?

Exclude factors such as personal pref.'s, boredom, etc.

My argument: It is easier to produce faster times on a treadmill because... (a) you have to use less force to propel yourself forward on a treadmill as opposed to the road (b) the treadmill "carries" you more whereas on the road you are def. the one carrying yourself to go forward (c) combination of these 2 lets you "cheat" your times on a treadmill by being able to run at a faster pace and produce faster times

1) Technically you cannot run 5 miles on a TM unless you have a 5mile long TM. You merely are vertically displacing yourself (being a smart ass here).

2) You might be able to run faster since there is no air resistance on a TM compare to outside. The amount of resistance increases with speed (exponentially) but at running speeds this is relatively small (not like cycling were at speeds of ~15mph, air resistance becomes a big issue).

3) However, the heat might limit performance unless you have air flow for condensation.

4) If you set the TM to the right speed, you are "forced" to keep up. Outside you might lag.

Unless there are races out there on TM, it is moot since races are run outside.

I think its easier on the roads... i have a hard time breathing on the treadmill. And I also don't always run a completely even race -- i tend to pick it up a bit at the end, and so on, and it takes a little bit of effort to hold down the "increase speed" button... you're holding down the button instead of swinging your arms for a few seconds. It breaks up your rhythm a bit. Also, the road is harder, so wouldn't that make it a bit faster?

tredmills are dumb. Run in the cold, rain, snow, etc, or all the above, that's how you get balls.

tredmills are dumb. Run in the cold, rain, snow, etc, or all the above, that's how you get balls.

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Thanks for the explanation. That explains how badly Kim Jones, Ingrid Kristiansen, Christine Clarke, and Ken Martin have done at the marathon distance. Gotcha.

1. You need the same force to propel your body forward relative to a surface, regardless if that surface is the ground outside or a belt on a treadmill. There is no difference in the force used on a treadmill.

2. The treadmill does not "carry" you.

Still treadmill running is easier. In the very least it's certainly different. The major differences are:.

1. There is no air resistance on the mill. When you run normally, you are moving, relative to the air around you and must fight the air-resistance. (add a head wind and it's worse). But on the treadmill, you are not moving at all relative to the air around you so it is easier to move at a faster speed. This might be the reason why you felt you needed less force to propel yourself forward on the mill

2. The "ground" on a treadmill isn't a consistent as the ground outside. What I mean is, when you step on the belt it causes more friction between the belt and the platform. This slows down the belt a fraction because it stresses the motor. Then as your foot moves backwards, the friction lessens and the belt resume speed. A strong motor will make these changes almost unnoticeable.

3. The treadmill platform itself is usually somewhat cushioned.

"Ever see a Kenyan on the 'mills?" Didn't think so.

Get out in the elements, that's what it's all about.

Of course one could argue that many Kenyans couldn't afford a treadmill, and besides, the last time I checked Kenya doesn't suffer from weeks of 10F temps with whipping snow.

Ultimately, I think the answer is keyed to "Where will you get your most effective workout?" Slogging through blinding snow or freezing rain may be a difficult exercise, but that doesn't mean that it's the most effective thing you could've done that day. Then again, if you RACE in that sort of weather, it makes sense to TRAIN in it.

I actually do lots of running on treadmills in the winter time, and if I've done so for a few days and then head outside for a moderate run, the next day my quads are sore. So, regardless of which is easier, it has at least been my experience that running outside stresses the quads more than running on a treadmill. Certainly at some level this stress should be sought after, so getting in some regular running outside seems to be the optimal idea.

Good point.

Guess I just get a little disgusted when I go to my gym for my weight workout and there are always a lot of folks on the 'mills year round and we have a beautiful park with extensive trails right down the road! Some of them look like they've been assimilated by the Borg and there are about 10 mind numbing TVs in front of them.

Certainly, there are times when it's counterproductive to run outside. I almost got killed once when I was running at night during an ice storm. Not too B-R-I-G-H-T. I crossed an intersection, lost my footing on some ice and slid right under some guy's car. He wasn't moving at the time. I'll never forget the look on that guys face!

"Ever see a Kenyan on the 'mills?" Didn't think so.

Get out in the elements, that's what it's all about."

I take it you don't personally know nor have run with any Kenyans.

Do you often see a Kenyan racing in January in Minnesota or Maine? The Kenyans I know and have run with don't even like to run when it is below 40. Holding the Kenyans up as exemplars of environmental toughness shows you don't know too many. Run with most Kenyans when it is 20 degrees and they will be bundled up and complaining. They really do tend to hate the cold. I have seen plenty of Kenyans on treadmills or heard them talk about treadmills.

I love the stereotypes about Kenyans from people who don't know any. When I was in NM, I knew Kenyans who never ran on trails and just didn't like trail running. Another stereotype of Kenyans from people who don't know. I also saw A-caliber roadwhore Kenyans drinking beer and eating McDonalds.

I don't know if I fall into the taller/faster rule that mo spoke of, but running on a treadmill is much harder for me. I can produce MUCH faster times on the road or track. 7 min pace on the TM feels like about 6 min pace on the road to me.

I think treadmills suck...we aren't lab rats (well we aren't supposed to be)

I know that's not the point of the discussion.

For those of you who don't have lives or jobs, maybe you can run outside in the daylight every damn day. For those of us who have jobs have to work from 7am-6pm, then rush home to have dinner with the wife and kids, bathe the kids, play with them, then maybe have time for a run. Most of my days, i can either run at 5:30 in the morning, or 8pm at night. When it's 3 degrees and snowing outside (i live in MA), sometimes running downstairs on the mill is my only option. Coming down a hill in the dark at 6am, and hitting a patch of black ice, is not my idea of ideal training conditions.

I thank the lord for my treadmill, every damn day during the winter.

Surprise! wrote:

I think treadmills suck...we aren\'t lab rats (well we aren\'t supposed to be)

I agree with you.

Like most threads on the board: extremism is the rule when it shouldn't be. I prefer to run outside but treadmill running can be an effective training tool. The evenness of the surface, the pace control, and the absence of other external stimuli (from watching out for cars to watching your footing) can free up your mind to full proprioceptive feedback. One run a week on a treadmill in which you concentrate on all aspects of your running form will improve your running dexterity.

I agree with what the guy above me said