Webb article from Outside Mag

My favorite quote:

"If he doesn't, there's always Plan B. At Webb's pace of improvement—about a second per season—he'll need another four years to challenge the world mile record of 3:43.13, set by Morocco's Hicham El Guerrouj in 1999."

In seven years, he'll break 3:40!

that article makes me completely think he's screwed next week

i mean being constantly reminded that he's being coached by his HS coach....i mean....

i still hate the people who say he's old at 25 and needs to retire.....(esp looking at lagat)....but if he had a legit coach....

"In the last 50m he is almost impossible to beat"

Unless he is in a championship race with 9 other guys with equal ability - then Webb may have a great last 50m, but the winner has already finished.

Also, sounds like Raczko is focusing on fitness, rather than racing skill, which Webb doesn't have as was hinted at in the article. Sounds like Webb will be doing the same ol' same ol.

Now, Webb has barely raced all season ... I'd say he's 50/50 for making the team. I hope that he doesn't and spends his time getting his sh1t together.

50/50 is about right I'd say

That's quite a picture of Webb. Very homoerotic.

uh_no wrote:

that article makes me completely think he's screwed next week

i mean being constantly reminded that he's being coached by his HS coach....i mean....

i still hate the people who say he's old at 25 and needs to retire.....(esp looking at lagat)....but if he had a legit coach....

I have to agree. Look at someone like Taylor Milne (see thread elsewhere) - a pretty regular guy whose coach played a huge role in getting this guy to run 3:36, that is just an off the top example of how good coaching makes a huge difference. I think AW is a huge talent that runs well in spite of his coach, but better coaching would likely smooth out the valleys in this guys career (notwithstanding that AW was not happy at Mich).

aye

www wrote:

...I think AW is a huge talent that runs well in spite of his coach, but better coaching would likely smooth out the valleys in this guys career (notwithstanding that AW was not happy at Mich).

Webb went to another coach and it didn't work. If you don't want me assuming it to be Warhurst's fault, then don't assume it to be Webb's fault. Another coach didn't work. I also remember plenty on here stating that Brannen was more talented than Webb during that year. Funny how Webb was suddenly not that talented when he was away from Raczko.

Webb may need to continue learning race tactics. But having the guts to run away from the competition with his AR PR is not a problem. Would it be better to allow 3:44 1500's with the entire pack at the bell?? Nope.

ttc wrote:

Webb may need to continue learning race tactics. But having the guts to run away from the competition with his AR PR is not a problem.

He failed to do it in both the semifinals and finals of the World Championships last year, in the middle of a great year. If he lacked the confidence to do it last year, why would he suddenly have the confidence this year?

He's a great talent, but the clock is ticking for Webb. One second a year improvement for several years is not likely. Most milers run their fastest by their mid-20s. (Webb is 25.) Steve Scott ran the previous American record when he was 26. Jim Ryun ran his fastest by the time he was 20. The man who Webb was faster than at age 18 -- Hicham El-Guerrouj -- by age 25 had set two world records over the 1500 and mile and won two World Championships. He never ran any faster.

If Webb does not win a medal soon, it's likely he'll never medal.

HEG won olympic gold at 30.....

which is about 5 years down the road for webb

uh_no wrote:

he's being coached by his HS coach

Doesn't that make two of you, then?

Les wrote:

ttc wrote:

Webb may need to continue learning race tactics. But having the guts to run away from the competition with his AR PR is not a problem.

He failed to do it in both the semifinals and finals of the World Championships last year, in the middle of a great year...

I'm talking about running away from some of the past U.S. fields. Against U.S. fields when (in the past) they had much slower PR's, then definitely Webb should've led. Sorry, but anyone who argues this has zero guts. Ask Ryan Hall. Plus, Webb's race tactics last year in the final were not why he lost. He was in great position, but just didn't have it that day.

uh_no wrote:

HEG won olympic gold at 30.....

which is about 5 years down the road for webb

That's true. But that was El G, who had confidence Webb doesn't have. But the point is for WEBB, if you read the Outside article, it seems clear that he and his coach are counting on continued physical improvement to get them a medal. My point is, significant physical improvement for Webb isn't likely. At his level I would expect only incremental improvement. And what good is physical talent if the athlete lacks the confidence to use it? That's AW's big problem. Hopefully that will change.

"At five-nine and 145 pounds, Webb has a wiry, toned build, an eagle's beak, and ears so big you'd think they must flap when he runs. His face was still and blank, except for his eyes, which flicked back and forth like a cat's as he scanned the room for his coach." - Katie Arnold, Managing Editor - Outside Magazine.

WOW, talk about BRUTALLY honest. I wonder how SHE looks? Good thing he got the hair enhancements or she would be calling him "Golem".

I wonder if she interviewed Karnazes for Outside? If so, what kind of adjectives did she use?

ttc wrote:

I also remember plenty on here stating that Brannen was more talented than Webb during that year.

I don't remember that. I remember talking to Chris Lear when he was writing the book and he nor anyone else at Michigan had seen anyone with Webb's talent. Chris was amazed and still is.

I remember him calling me and saying, "I think he's going to win NCAA cross." I told him he was a miler and a freshman. Lear said you had to see it to believe it.

"If you're strong enough and have done the work, you have nothing to worry about," Webb argues. "You just have to go out and do it. If I had to sum up my mental strategy, that's it: When you've put in the training, you're more at ease mentally, and you can run better tactically."

I applaud Webb's ability to shrug of the critics. But, someone's gotta smack him over the head and tell him that the fastest guy wire-to-wire does not always win a championship race. Seems obvious (strength vs. savvy), but I am not sure he really gets this.

Every time he talks about his training he talks about wanting to be so strong that he's unbeatable in any type of race, rather being ready to RACE and mix it up with the best and win. Even El G was not unbeatable, took him three olympics to learn to dictate the terms of the race he needed to win.

I hope that with some maturity Webb has the confidence and patience to run smarter in Beijing.

ttc wrote:

www wrote:

...I think AW is a huge talent that runs well in spite of his coach, but better coaching would likely smooth out the valleys in this guys career (notwithstanding that AW was not happy at Mich).

Webb went to another coach and it didn't work. If you don't want me assuming it to be Warhurst's fault, then don't assume it to be Webb's fault. Another coach didn't work. I also remember plenty on here stating that Brannen was more talented than Webb during that year. Funny how Webb was suddenly not that talented when he was away from Raczko.

Webb may need to continue learning race tactics. But having the guts to run away from the competition with his AR PR is not a problem. Would it be better to allow 3:44 1500's with the entire pack at the bell?? Nope.

Just because it didn't work with one "good" coach doesn't mean that going back to your HS coach is a good idea. Webb did not give it enough time there to see if it would have worked.

Alternatively, there are other coaches nationally and internationally with proven track records.

Inconsistency should be taken out of the equation. I maintain good coaching can go a really long way to doing so.

And I have to say that tactics are not the issue right now. Dropping out of races, or never being in the mix in certain races is the issue.

wejo wrote:

ttc wrote:

I also remember plenty on here stating that Brannen was more talented than Webb during that year.

I don't remember that. I remember talking to Chris Lear when he was writing the book and he nor anyone else at Michigan had seen anyone with Webb's talent. Chris was amazed and still is.

I remember him calling me and saying, "I think he's going to win NCAA cross." I told him he was a miler and a freshman. Lear said you had to see it to believe it.

I remember posters (not coaches or Lear) saying this, that Brannen was the better prospect. This was during their freshman track season. But like you say, I totally remember only huge praise for Webb's talent from Lear, coaches and U-M runners. But my point is that posters were minimizing his talent when Webb struggled... and then when he was running fast, they stated any goof could coach coach him to huge succeess (dissing Raczko). It's like bash either Webb or Raczko.

I think Webb's very talented, but almost psychotically driven... which makes me a huge fan of his. When he made that 2005 WC move at 800M, it backfired. But posters called him a clown and some accused him of using that move to give up. In Raczko, he's very inexperienced, but extremely passionate and usually gets Webb in insane shape. They both have more to learn... but Webb's 25 and Rackzo's in his lower 30's as a coach.

As ttc said, he ran a smart race at worlds, he just didn't have it. That's going to happen, even to the best. I think that quote is fine. It's basically all about confidence. When he's put in the work, he has the confidence to run the race tactically he needs to run. How is that different from any other runner?