How much does it affect the performance of those not running for CU and does the CU guys have an inherent advantage directly related to the altitude?
How much does it affect the performance of those not running for CU and does the CU guys have an inherent advantage directly related to the altitude?
Yes, the CU guys "does" have an inherent advantage because of Boulder's altitude "affect," but not as much as a lot of people seem to think.
Boulder is just over a mile up, right? It's been calculated that the difference between sea level and ~5,000ft is considerably less than that between a place like Boulder (or Denver) and somewhere like Flagstaff or Mexico City, about 2,000ft higher. Flagstaff just hurts.
The CU guys' main advantage, I've long believed, is that their opponents *expect* CU to do well at home, and the opponents will more readily back off from a strong pace.
That said, there is a true physiological difference for flatlanders who go a mile up, but it should be a minute or less (over 10,000m) for most. The CU guys, living at altitude, will overcome very roughly half that disadvantage.
Wrong!
does austin/college station/waco high humidity and heat give ut/a&m/baylor an advantage when they host big 12's?
yes probably slightly but no where near the effect of Boulders altitude...
if you dont think boulders elevation makes a significant difference youve never tried to train at a high level at altitude coming from sea level...
but no matter...theyde dominate the 5k-10k anyway, now its just to a higher degree
Effect
You guys should read Lore of Running. Noakes has a good deal of info on the effects of altitude. The guy who said going from 0ft to 5000ft doesn't hurt times as much as going from 5000ft t0 7000ft is WRONG, though the graph of time vs altitude is exponential. Why don't you look up the NCAA qualifying times?
Do the CU guys have an advantage? Yes. Altitude hurts those not used to it more than those who ARE used to it. Like me........ said, CU would probably dominate the longer races anyway, but having the home field advantage just makes it that much easier.
and it really depends on how long they are at altitude. the first three days it is much easier to train and race than anything after that.
It also has an "affect" in the sprints and throws, especially for participants who train at sea level.
NCAA conversions:
Event 10 Men 1500 Meter Run
=======================================================================
World: W 3:26.00 1998 Hicham El Guerrouj, Morcocco
Collegiate: C 3:35.29 2007 Leonel Manzano, Texas
Big 12 Meet: M 3:40.70 2006 Stephen Pifer, Colorado
Big 12 Best: B 3:33.1h 1967 Jim Ryan, Kansas
Reg. Qualify: R 3:53.36
Stadium: S 3:47.75 2008 Stephen Pifer, Colorado
Name Year School Finals Points
=======================================================================
Finals
1 Leonel Manzano SR Texas 3:41.80S 10
2 Stephen Pifer SR Colorado 3:43.65S 8
3 Peter van der Westhuizen SR Nebraska 3:47.58S 6
4 Darren Brown SR Texas 3:49.08R 5
5 Kyle Miller JR Texas 3:51.60R 4
6 Jacob Boone Oklahoma 3:52.57R 3
7 Erik Stanley SR Texas 3:54.71 2
8 Tipper O'Brien SR Missouri 3:57.41 1
So a 5.56 adjustment for the regional Q. So Manzano's adjustment would be a 3:36. Pifer at 3:38, but he trains at CU so who actually knows. Extremely impressive for Manzano. I hope they put up the splits soon.
CU's about to win the Big 12 meet! Even with the domination of the distance events that's a pretty big feat for them, they're usually towards the bottom. Weren't they almost last indoors?
What's the conversion for the 800???
===========================================================
Finals
1 Jacob Hernandez JR Texas 1:48.28S 10
2 Tevan Everett SO Texas 1:50.15R 8
3 Tevas Everett SO Texas 1:50.62R 6
4 Matt Baysinger SR Kansas 1:50.63R 5
5 James Galvan JR Iowa State 1:50.86R 4
6 Sam James SO Kansas State 1:52.18 3
7 Gilbert Limo Texas Tech 1:53.38 2
8 Edwin Sang Texas Tech 1:54.93 1
The CU men won the big 12 title. The programs first conference win since 1946 when they belonged to the Mountain States Conference. CU was leading the meet heading into the mens 5k where they scored 32 points and placed 6 runners. Congrats to Wetmore and his coaches! A great day for the program and for Buff fans.
no conversion - 800m is the "breakeven" point.
RRRR wrote:
What's the conversion for the 800???
===========================================================
Finals
1 Jacob Hernandez JR Texas 1:48.28S 10
2 Tevan Everett SO Texas 1:50.15R 8
3 Tevas Everett SO Texas 1:50.62R 6
4 Matt Baysinger SR Kansas 1:50.63R 5
5 James Galvan JR Iowa State 1:50.86R 4
6 Sam James SO Kansas State 1:52.18 3
7 Gilbert Limo Texas Tech 1:53.38 2
8 Edwin Sang Texas Tech 1:54.93 1
curious... wrote:
NCAA conversions:
http://www1.ncaa.org/eprise/main/playingrules/track/AltitNCAAOutdoor_2008.pdf?ObjectID=50353&ViewMode=0&PreviewState=0
Appreciate the link. I see that I was right (NCAA conversion between sea level and Boulder is almost exactly a minute), and wrong (between Boulder and Flagstaff is only around another half-minute, not the minute-plus I implied).
I guess I was misled by my personal experience in Denver and Flagstaff. Thanks for setting me straight!
The conversion makes Manzano and Pifer's time pretty impressive then.
1. Manzano - 3:41.80 = 3:35.22
2. Pifer - 3:43.65 = 3:37.07
Those two times have to be top five times in the US this year I would think.
Altitude wrote:
The conversion makes Manzano and Pifer's time pretty impressive then.
1. Manzano - 3:41.80 = 3:35.22
2. Pifer - 3:43.65 = 3:37.07
Those two times have to be top five times in the US this year I would think.
No doubt! It wasn't exactly ideal conditions either. A bit warm and windy. Pifer took the pace until 300 to go. I think Manzano is in 3:34 shape or faster right now under ideal conditions.
It says on U of Texas website that Leo is a senior. Is this accurate? Has he redshirted?
If nothing else, these results may answer my own question. The CU guys, without a question, had an inherent advantage over the rest of the field. Kiel Uhl is not a 15 minute 5k guy.
Event 12 Men 5000 Meter Run
=======================================================================
World: W 12:37.35 2004 Kenenisa Bekele, Ethiopia
Collegiate: C 13:08.4h 1978 Henry Rono, Washington State
Big 12 Meet: M 13:53.01 2005 Brent Vaughn, Colorado
Big 12 Best: B 13:10.95 1993 Jonah Koech, Iowa State
Reg. Qualify: R 14:37.51
Stadium: S 14:26.2h 1978 Simon Kilili, Wyoming
Name Year School Finals Points
=======================================================================
Finals
1 Brent Vaughn SR Colorado 14:13.99S 10
2 Kenyon Neuman JR Colorado 14:22.61S 8
3 David Jankowski SR Oklahoma State 14:35.57R 6
4 Richard Medina FR Colorado 14:40.92 5
5 Stephen Pifer SR Colorado 14:42.01 4
6 Bradley Harkrader JR Colorado 14:44.05 3
7 Matt Tebo FR Colorado 14:55.35 2
8 Kiel Uhl SO Iowa State 14:58.17 1
9 Chris Pannone JR Colorado 15:05.45
10 Dan Hedgecock SO Missouri 15:07.35
And using your logic, the results show that without a question, the rest of the field had an advantage over the Buffs. Brent Vaughn is not 14:14 5k guy.
Obviously, your logic is flawed.
Uhl PR - 14:08; @ Potts - 14:58; Difference 50 seconds
Vaughn PR - 13:18; @ Potts - 14:14; Difference 56 seconds
Where is this supposed altitude advantage? It looks like Vaughn suffered more from the altitude than Uhl.