Testing Distance Runners..... Bekele

WR in track and field must also be accompanied by doping tests. If it is the US, most likely USADA will do the testing.

Several years back someone broke the shot record (maybe it was a junior) and a USADA doping control officer was dispatched to the meet. Testing had not been planned.

If you were a pro cyclist then you should know about doping. Funny how you got out just when testing began to get serious. Coincidence?

Cycling testing is pretty sketchy as well despite its high doping profile. No sport has a more pervasive drug culture than cycling.

Hey, I didn't say in my post that I or anyone else was clean during thoes years. You have to understand that if I didn't I would not have made a living doing it. Not proud of the fact. Trust me my kid will know all about it when she is old enough. I also know that USADA is like all of the other world NGB's and it is about medal count and world records. Do you really think that any of them were shocked about Marion. NO WAY, they all knew. That is why I wondered about running, how many times are the worlds big marathons tested?

What team did you ride for (if that\'s not too incriminating)? How official was your team doping, or was it kind of an \"everyone take care of yourself and don\'t talk about it\" thing? I\'m an aspiring Pro cyclist, just interested in how different the world of cycling use to be. Not that it is cleaner now, but that people hid it more.

luv2run wrote:

WR in track and field must also be accompanied by doping tests. If it is the US, most likely USADA will do the testing.

Several years back someone broke the shot record (maybe it was a junior) and a USADA doping control officer was dispatched to the meet. Testing had not been planned.

If you were a pro cyclist then you should know about doping. Funny how you got out just when testing began to get serious. Coincidence?

Cycling testing is pretty sketchy as well despite its high doping profile. No sport has a more pervasive drug culture than cycling.

Cycling has gone further than any other sport in recent years to detect doping, as evidenced by the recently adopted "biological passport". Alas, the dopers are still well ahead of the testers.

Pro Cyclist wrote:

Hey, I didn't say in my post that I or anyone else was clean during thoes years. You have to understand that if I didn't I would not have made a living doing it. Not proud of the fact. Trust me my kid will know all about it when she is old enough. I also know that USADA is like all of the other world NGB's and it is about medal count and world records. Do you really think that any of them were shocked about Marion. NO WAY, they all knew. That is why I wondered about running, how many times are the worlds big marathons tested?

I do not know for sure, but unless testing caused the runners to stay away, testing would not necessarily be bad for the race, and I think that they do do testing sometimes. As far as the NGB, splitting that task off of USATF (into USADA) did indeed lead to more independence. I think that USADA is more aligned with WADA than it is with the national governing bodies. Also, look at the variations you have in cycling now, with CONI pursuing top riders (DeLuca) despite it costing the country some reputational hits and top riders for the Worlds and top PV guys (Gib). In contrast, I do not trust the Spanish yet and the Astana situation last year raised questions (that the home country might now be trying to rectify).

As for the pressures to get medals at the national level, it is true that that is the case. However, is it advantageous to have the stars then lose those medals?

The team was Colstrop, smaller team and the doping was not done by the team but the riders. Now the DS knew but back then all DS knew the riders were on somthing. I knew quite a few French guys that lived in the area that were on bigger UCI teams that were on doping programs. I just get really pissed when cycling is the sport that is getting the black eyes when in reality they are the only ones really trying to keep things level at this point. There is not a doubt in my mind that the top 10-12 runners (track or marathon) are on somthing, hate to tell you all but there are plenty of "aids" out there that have no tests and will not for the Olympics. Hate to be a buzz kill but all the WR's that have been produced over the past 8-10 years are stained. I also want it to be know that I realize that cycling has had a huge problem and still does but at least they seem to be trying. If they weren't then they would have let Astana and all the other marked teams ride the TDF.

In fairness, you know about cycling, but i think your cynicism is ott with athletics. I truly believe radcliffe's wr is clean, I'd stake my career on it, i'm that sure. Obviously, i agree that many other are suspect, but to say that everyone who has set a wr is dirty is unfair, although if i'd to take a guess myself i'd say three quarters of them (but not all) were dirty.

Women's 800m record is clean. I'd bet my 3rd nut on it.

This is getting interesting... I dont like to accuse people before there is certain proof. Its an absolute shame that the fundamental sport has to have such scum dominating it.

Now to cycling. Whats your opinion pro cyclist and any other person on Austalian cyclists. I know this covers mostly track cycling but the setup of the AIS i think its called. I remember a couple of years back that some kind of program and a few cyclists were under suspician (every cyclist is a suspect, but u know what i mean). Not sure of my facts. But Australia is very quite about drug news. Whats your knowledge of this country sport drugcheat culture. What cyclist were or are on not drugs? Tell me i need someone to cheer on at TDF

Sorry i know this site is LetsRun not LetsBikeride.

Pro Cyclist wrote:

Ok, I just read that Bekele was coming to the US to try to break the world 10k mark. Now I was a pro cyclist in Belgium from 93-99 and I know how testing in the cycling world works but was curious about distance running. See in cycling if there was ever and attempt at a world record (velodrome) there were drug testes there, manditory. Is it the same in running? So if Bekele breaks the record is he going to be rushed off the track by IAAF officials or will he be taken care of by the "Ethiopian DR's" for testing. She I think that distance running has a huge number of cheats in it because the testing is limited and very schetchy. Let me know your oppinion runners.

Of course Bekele is tested frequently, and always after WRs.

He has never tested positive for any drugs for which no tests exists.

There is a drug testing procedure using the hair to test. It is mainly used in family law and child protection cases but can be used to test back over a period of three months. This type of test has been available for quite some time and I would be surprised if WADA and other agencies did not know of it's availablity as a testing procedure. If it could be developed for use to detect PEDS then I am sure most athletes who cheat would think twice. If it could be used to test for EPO for example then that would be a major advance.

I'm curious if you knew of any big name riders from your era who you are sure are clean. Of course, you can't be absolutely certain, but even Wily Voet mentions a few riders who refused to dope.

Incidently, Astana's exclusion was purely political, otherwise they would have excluded Team High Road (T-Mobile), Rabobank and Cofidis, all squads that have been riddled with drug scandals year in and out.

I know that the former head coach of Aussie cycling was a very strong anti doping advocate. He was known to have raided fridges and cupboards on training camps etc. Didn't stop many of the riders however. Didn't always make him to popular either.

Ok, I see a few post yesterday. Being a road cyclist I didn't know the track world as much. I think the AIS has done a pretty good job of keeping things clean but like I said there are things out there that can not be tested for even in your hair. I don't want to paint the picture that everybody riding in the 90's in Europe was dirty but I will say that anyone that was winning big or often was doped. There were quite a few guys who didn't have the finances to dope and they were usually pack fill domistiques. I will go and say that there has not been a TDF winner since about 86 that was clean. And I have some doubts on that year also. Looking at the TDF this year I would say that cheering for Cadel would be a good clean bet.

Pro Cyclist, if you are by your own admission not a running/T+F expert then why the f(&k do your assertions that the 'Top 10-12' in all running /track events are on something illegal have any credence. I doubt there's anything in cycling that compares directly to the running cultures of Kenya and Ethiopia - who provide most of the Top 10-12 in men's endurance events- so you don't really have a clue on this.

Fyi, I know certain world Major marathons routinely test Top 3 and 3 random others in the Top 10 or 15. Almost nobody ever tests positive in the Majors - it's unannounced out of comp tests that unearth most of the positives

I bet you that like most good cycling teams runners train together, and if one is having success being on somthing then you see the group on the same stuff. I have read many articles that the top Africans train together. That is why I think what I said about the top 10-12. Also look at the WR's back when Moorcroft and Barios had the 5 and 10 look at what the records before they broke it were. They didn't knock off a bunch of time. So you are telling me that when the 10,000 WR was 26:58 the next guy to come along runs 15 sec. faster BS. Shoes and training don't get you that much faster.

Lance is clean, right?

tony-runner wrote:

There is a drug testing procedure using the hair to test.

This would be pretty funny if it was incorporated into the TDF testing protocol; every TDF rider would be as bald as a cue ball.

As to the guy who thinks that T&F being different/cleaner than cycling you, my friend, are delusional. Just because they are Africans doesn't make them less likely to cheat. They have even greater motivation to cheat because the stakes are materially higher than anyone else in the world.

If they don't cheat they are to be commended but the burden of proof is definitely on them, as it is with any other T&F athlete that has competed in the past three decades. Unfortunately the days of assuming innocence is long gone…

I don't necessarily think that taking that much time off the world records is that impossible...especially among the africans. When the first Africans started to make names for themselves on the running scene, I'm sure the numbers of young africans started rising explosively, making the competition over there that much better. I'm not saying all of them are clean, just possible that the world records could be.