Going from 1:30 Half to 3:10 Marathon

pendejo wrote:

The other guy's right - don't expect "Daniels equivalent" performances in 42k & 21k on relatively low mileage and experience.

I'm about your age, running four years, similar 21k time after a year, down to 1:23 in October. Having tried a few approaches, so far my best training was last fall. Key elements:

- my highest mileage to date

- lots of doubles

- MP run every week (following a couple miles slower warmup + strides)

- second workout: intervals first few months, "strength" workouts in HMP-MP range later

- shorter long runs than generally recommended: a 19, a 23, but usually about 16 miles

- Daniels 10k training (more or less) in spring didn't yield the results I hoped, but may have set me up well for fall

Astute readers will say "aha, he was reading Hansons and malmo" and they'd be correct.

There's some variation in how we respond to training and what worked best for me might not for you - you'll figure some of this out via trial and error as you go. Try some different things your first N years, see what you like and respond to. Trust what has worked for you; respect and try what has worked for others; don't put too much stock in one-size-fits-all training programs; be very skeptical of scientific studies without plenty of real-life confirmation by runners.

And don't forget that injury is not exactly unknown for highly motivated 40ish novices so listen to your body, and bear in mind it's better to take it easy a few days than miss a few weeks or months. Over time you get more attuned to what's just typical discomfort you can safely ignore. I sure didn't have that all figured out in my second year.

Jim beam running formula wrote:

I'm with the OP and a few others here. 40 years old, running for 4 years, and trying to BQ. It's just so damn hard. (Especially at 6'2" and 185-190 lbs)

I've run half marathons over the past two years of 1:31, 1:29, and 1:28. But marathon PR is only 3:19 after 4 marathons (3:10 is a BQ). My 1:28 predicts sub 3:10 but it just doesn't work that way.

Trying a few different things this year:

1. Increasing mileage to 70 (up from 60)

2. In and out workouts, alternating between marathon pace and 10k pace (instead of just steady marathon pace runs)

3. Injecting some faster pace segments into long run workouts along with the usual marathon pace segments (instead of just finishing the last 25% at marathon pace)

4. Race weight to low 180's?

5. Super shoes? I bought the New Balances Fuel Cell Elite 2's but typically run in stability shoes. Ran my first race in them last month, saw a race pic of myself in these and zoomed in on my ankle. Cringe-worthy. So super shoes may not be in the cards for me unless they come out with a support version?

Hoping these, and just another year under my belt, will yield a big breakthrough, but I'd be thrilled with 3:15. 3:10 doesn't seem realistic this year, but next year???

slow old guy wrote:

i know it's way too slow for many of you but i'm relatively old and pretty new to this running thing.

41 yr old male, 5'10", 155lbs, running only 1 year (april '06)

first half mary was 1:51 in october '06

down to 1:38 in feb, 1:36 in mar, 1:34 in april and am reasonably comfortable i'll get to about 1:30 in july.

current training is about 40-50/week over 6 days.

wed 4-6 miles tempo (6:50-7:00),

fri 5xmile repeats (6:30-6:40),

sun 12-16 long runs with last 1/4 around HMP.

rest is easy miles on rolling hills at 8ish pace.

after (hopefully) going sub 1:30 in july it's time to focus on training for a full. i will have 20 weeks before my race in december. i ran a full after just 6 months and it was a complete train wreck - completely fell apart at mile 20 and had to drag my ass the last 6 miles to finish in 4:10. of course i was only doing 25 mpw so no big surprise.

other than just ratchet up the miles to 60-70, get the weekly long runs up to 16-22, what else should i change?

Daniels says that 1:30 equates to 3:10 but having seen what happens on the dark side of 20 miles i want to make sure i'm doing everything i can to make this happen.

thanks!

Jim beam running formula wrote:

I'm with the OP and a few others here. 40 years old, running for 4 years, and trying to BQ. It's just so damn hard. (Especially at 6'2" and 185-190 lbs)

I've run half marathons over the past two years of 1:31, 1:29, and 1:28. But marathon PR is only 3:19 after 4 marathons (3:10 is a BQ). My 1:28 predicts sub 3:10 but it just doesn't work that way.

Trying a few different things this year:

1. Increasing mileage to 70 (up from 60)

2. In and out workouts, alternating between marathon pace and 10k pace (instead of just steady marathon pace runs)

3. Injecting some faster pace segments into long run workouts along with the usual marathon pace segments (instead of just finishing the last 25% at marathon pace)

4. Race weight to low 180's?

5. Super shoes? I bought the New Balances Fuel Cell Elite 2's but typically run in stability shoes. Ran my first race in them last month, saw a race pic of myself in these and zoomed in on my ankle. Cringe-worthy. So super shoes may not be in the cards for me unless they come out with a support version?

Hoping these, and just another year under my belt, will yield a big breakthrough, but I'd be thrilled with 3:15. 3:10 doesn't seem realistic this year, but next year???