BADWATER RESULTS SHOW MAJOR FLAW IN ULTRAS BEING COMPETITIVE

Yeah, it's not like they do that at many track meets, eh? Go to IAAF and look at the past few weeks...the 'A' group, the 'B' group, the boys in the band, the local kids, ...

See above.

You mean like where El G was half a lap ahead of someone in just 1500 meters, or Gatlin was 10 meters ahead of someone in just 100 meters, or someone from Kenya was two minutes ahead of someone in a 12k XC race, or ... Yer right, it's a good thing "real" running is so evenly competitive--parity across the continents... yeah, right, sure.

It's not really a race.

It's not USATF certified.

They let them take naps.

They make them run in the heat.

They don't even have aid stations.

They just do this to let people who can't run sub-4 miles have a place to play.

Ultras have no depth in the field and they do not appear to be very competative events. I have said it before, but they have managed to take the sport of distance running and distilled it down to one element- endurance. (I think someone else compared to the an eye poking contest.)

Many triathlons have wave starts, so do a lot of larger road races. What about the time trials at the TdF?

time trials are meant to be individual tests. there are only two or three of them each year and they are widely spaced apart. most of the race is done in a large pack, the tt's are simply thrown in there for variation and to open the time gaps. there is no comparison to a race like this.

TdF is not competitive, because they all start together.

Come on you are comparing this to a time trial in cylcing? The time trial in cycling is set just as that. So anotherwords Badwater is no more than an individual time trial like the previous poster stated. Badwater isnt much of a competition against other athletes as it is against the clock.

I think that was the original posters thoughts. Badwater is a test of endurance against yourself but isnt really much of a race in terms of racing against your competitors.

Also when you have wave starts in marathons it is not like the people in different waves are vying for the win. All the individuals who are potential winners START TOGETHER and race each other. Also the A, B and C standards in meets are set up in terms of performance. Yes occasionally you have a guy who runs fast in the C group but in most cases this is not the situtation. That then allows that guy to work his way up to the real race which is the A race.

And this is never the case in big meets like worlds or the Olympics. You run in heats but then the final is run against all the competitors not like they determine the winner form the fastest heat and give him the medal like Badwater!

Same case for triathlon waves. If you are fast and are elite vying for the win you start with the top guys. The waves are age group waves. If you are a top dog though you are starting with the other top dogs. The guys who do well in age group races etc set themselves up to be able to move to the real race.

step up wrote:

Many triathlons have wave starts...

I also hate watching triathlons. Boring when you can't instantly see or tell who is in the real lead. Sucky, sucky, sucky.

Go run Badwater and finish it, you pyssu. Then come back and mouth off, K?

All this hating for what reason?

We must hate what we do not understand. Just ask any Christian or Republican.

Kwik-E-Fart wrote:

We must hate what we do not understand. Just ask any Christian or Republican.

Perhaps they hate it because they do understand it.

Perhaps you like it because you do not fully understand it.

I didnt say that i didnt respect what they accomplish did I? I think I just pointed out the fact that it isnt a race against the fellow man so it lacks that competitiveness. I don't think I could do this race nor do I have the desire. Just pointing out my observation on the lack of the true competitivwe nature of this race, man against man. It is more like a time trial.

How would have this race played out if the two top finishers were actually in the same heat? It would have possibily been a different race. If you can see your competition right in front of you that may be all the motivation you need. But when you are racing time only that may have a different psychological affect.

And my point regarding the fact that the first place guy litterally beats most of the field by a day that is pointing out there is a real lack of serious competitors in the race (ie someoen with the ability to win the race).

Hey Jed,

I don't see Christians banning atheism across the board. You're a close minded person. please feel free to calm yourself and get a life.

This thread is about stupid ultras. Let's stick to making fun of the topic at hand. If you want to start another socialist thread, please do so. Feel free to use that as the title. another socialist thread. or it could be another Hateful Socialist Thread. You could even do "I hate anyone who believes in anything or stands for anything" as the title.

Ultras are silly. The eye poking contest comment cracked me up.

Hey "the front"

I think you meant to address your comment to Kwik-E-Fart. Jed actually made a really good point, one that i notice almost daily.

Anyway,

How many people actually compete in this race anyway? is there a need for three starts? Are they cogging the roads out there in Death Valley?

This cannot be compared to road races with wave starts, no one in wave two is oging to be competing with the people in wave 1.

I noticed Jurek started at 10am, so WTF?

Not bashing, but this seems stupid. I want to like ultras, but they are always pulling crap like this. it seems like they want to make everything non-competitive.

The top seeded start in the 3rd wave. You are seeded by the time you turn in. Number of starters is limited 85 to 100. About 25 or so in each starting wave.

Yes, the wave start is required by the NPS, even though the traffic may be very light. Many of the competitors will have more than one support vehicle/crew.

Because of the terrain ie. sand, canyon, rocks, etc.), you can only park slightly off the roadway.

And by the way, most of the people in wave 3 overtake and beat wave 1 & 2 runners, normally.

This is just one of those exceptions. Perhaps the competitor in wave 1 asked to be there OR his entry time indicated he should be there.

I think completing Badwater would be good enough for me, screw my time or placing.

This is the issue,

Relax.

Runners are assigned to waves based on their predicted finish times. Rookies go in the 6:00am wave. Given that rookies could be unpredictably good or bad, there is always the possibility that someone from the 6:00am wave will place high in the standings. That happened this year, but I don't think you ought to judge the whole race on something you didn't know. If you look through previous years, you will find that the "early starter" phenomenon isn't all that common.

Three waves are important for crowding and safety. If you think a run in the heat of Death Valley is "against other runners," then you don't understand ultramarathons in general, or this one in particular.

And thus the kettle yelled at the pot again.

You said Christians don't deserve to be condemned by atheists.

And then you proceeded to deride non-Christians as communists who don't believe in anything.

Well done. LOL. I don't agree with the generalization made by Kwik-E-Fart but he certainly pegged you perfectly.