Footlocker/Brooks: Reina's 14:36 in not legitimate

No, the course is actually a bit easier now.

of course he wouldn't have won by 34 seconds. If he went out at 14:36 pace it would have forced the rest of the field today to not run like P*ssies at the start. Their second 800 was 2:29 ffs.

Comparing pre Nike zoom Victory HS distance running to post superspike&supershoe era HS distance.

Do I need to elaborate why this is wrong?

Reina ran 8:58.0 for the full 2 mile at Keebler as a senior, 8:54 at Texas relays as a junior.

He also ran 3:46 for 1500 as a senior. Not the times the kids consistently run these days but I still wouldn't bet against him if he ran this course today. He was tough as hell and like another poster pointed out, not at all scared to take the pace out and force the field to go with him. He took it to all timers like the Mastalir twins and Trautmann

His time and performance were legit

Outside of broad generalities and obvious situations where the math doesn’t math, there’s no way to claim that done with time X “should” also run time Y. Everyone’s different, everyone has their best day ever at a different time/season/meet/event, etc.

Time to stop using Mt. SAC right before Nationals. Brutal for the west to hit all those hills, poop out, etc. and a week later race. Other regions get time off in between and run cupcake regional races.

LOL!!! Imagine being of the bouncy-shoes generation and criticizing Reina. Must be nice.

Super shoes ruin the sport in track

Bro he made that look easy. Short stout legs like Mantecon today.

As someone who knows the Balboa Park course better than almost anyone (and who is at the course right now), yes, the course has changed materially since Reuben Reina ran 14:36 back in 1985.

First of all, the condition of the course was much better back then. I doubt that the City of San Diego will ever put in the time, money, and effort to make the course in great shape again.

Also, the course was shorter back then in at least 3 places.

1. Going around the pool. The path was diagonal-ish on the sides of the pool, instead of right angles like now.

2. In the valley. In 1985 the course didn't go all the way to the sidewalk like it dies now. ( The course only started going out to the sidewalk in 1988.)

3. Top of the big hill. In 1985 the course didnt go through the 2 big trees at the top of the big downhill like it has for the past 20 years. It slanted in front of those 2 big trees.

Ironically, this year Brooks reinstated the 1980s way of running slanted in front of the big trees. But Brooks also added a big loop that went way above those 2 big trees and also above the round kids play area which added more distance than the slant saves. So today's course was longer that it had been for the past 20 years, with the exception of the 2024 course, which was accidentally made too long.

Conclusion - The course is now significantly longer than it was in 1985. And it's in worse shape.

Additional note - Regarding today's race, the course was wetter than usual which made the times about 10 seconds slower than they would have been otherwise.

Can the record be broken? - With the current course setup the chances of the boys course record being broken are not good.

On the other hand, the 16:39 girls course record from 1990 can probably be broken because the course in 1990 was longer than the course was in 1985. If the course had been dry today, Natasza Dudek and Blair Bartlett would have run around 16:45 and 16:47 which isn't too far off.

If they both stay healthy for the next 12 months, and the course is dry next year, we could see not just one but two girls go after the course record.

I think the answer is that in 1985, Kinney National was the only game in town. Reina probably didn’t have to run that hard to win his state meet and then had a regional meet and probably 2 weeks to prep.

Today, kids are slamming hard races with the best athletes from multiple states all the way in early September.

also, I’ve heard from a number of sources that the footing at Balboa has gotten consistently worse over the years. While CA’s other bellwether courses are getting faster, Balboa is getting slower.

Kinney was definitely the only game in town, Reina didn't exactly have it easy at state as he had to beat Tim Gargiulo (853) and his future Arkansas teammate Eric Henry (852). But I completely agree as prior to any post-season teams were just running in their own city for XC competition, there was no out of state travel to Mt Sac, Desert Twilight Woodbridge type meets (at least for the Texas programs)

Longer and worse footing.

only game or not, record isn’t as strong as it has seemed.

Wait a second. Aren't California courses the weakest in all 50 states. Now complaints on how tough this California cross country course is.

The record is as strong as it seems. It's not the course it's the way the race was run today. 4:32 opening mile in 1985. 2025 it was 4:48. It's a championship race. Time doesn't matter. Only winning does.

OR you choose to call out a young man of color. Disgusting. Plenty of other instances, but THIS!??

Do they measure it?

No one complained about “how tough” the course it. The debate in question is length then be length now.

I believe that Brooks measured it this year.

I suspect that in the 1980s they (Kinney) were just happy to have a race and they didn't seem to be very picky about the exact course length.