If I walked downtown in broad daylight and proceeded to whip it out and pee in an alley and then shout like a crazy person at people dining outside, I would (rightfully) be arrested and taken to jail within about 5 minutes. Likewise if I laid across the sidewalk blocking everyone's path and made threatening comments to passers by. Yet I see these same behaviors every day from the homeless, and the cops do nothing.
If I walked downtown in broad daylight and proceeded to whip it out and pee in an alley and then shout like a crazy person at people dining outside, I would (rightfully) be arrested and taken to jail within about 5 minutes. Likewise if I laid across the sidewalk blocking everyone's path and made threatening comments to passers by. Yet I see these same behaviors every day from the homeless, and the cops do nothing.
Why the double standard?
The big one for me is the littering. Basically their day to day jobs are scouring dumpsters, private trash bins or even peoples property looking for things to build camps with. They build the camps on sidewalks, parks, public spaces, the city comes and tells them to move on and they literally do just that - up and off, crap everywhere - thanks mom and dad for cleaning up after me. Repeat cycle.
I've ofter wondered about going to a city council meeting with a bag of trash, setting up a little stall in a corner and then just walking off. I mean what's the difference?
Of course the real answer to this is guilt and shame. You have people in positions of power that know they have let down these people. They are making high six figure incomes doing f-all while people are living under piles of garbage on sidewalks. So it's much easier to just let them do what they want and convince yourself this is some kind of good samaritan, altruistic act of goodness you are contributing to and if it's not your property that directly suffers, you're fine with that.
If I walked downtown in broad daylight and proceeded to whip it out and pee in an alley and then shout like a crazy person at people dining outside, I would (rightfully) be arrested and taken to jail within about 5 minutes. Likewise if I laid across the sidewalk blocking everyone's
I live in the most homeless understanding part of the US and even here a homeless dude would absolutely be arrested for that.
If I walked downtown in broad daylight and proceeded to whip it out and pee in an alley and then shout like a crazy person at people dining outside, I would (rightfully) be arrested and taken to jail within about 5 minutes. Likewise if I laid across the sidewalk blocking everyone's
I live in the most homeless understanding part of the US and even here a homeless dude would absolutely be arrested for that.
I live in Philly near Rittenhouse Square. I've seen all of these behaviors and have literally never seen a homeless person get arrested for anything.
If I walked downtown in broad daylight and proceeded to whip it out and pee in an alley and then shout like a crazy person at people dining outside, I would (rightfully) be arrested and taken to jail within about 5 minutes. Likewise if I laid across the sidewalk blocking everyone's path and made threatening comments to passers by. Yet I see these same behaviors every day from the homeless, and the cops do nothing.
Why the double standard?
Wow.
The homeless are the privileged people in America?
Because there’s nothing else you can take from them .
We could send them to El Salvador.
It shouldn't surprise me that "send them to concentration camps" is somehow on the table of options at this point in our history. Disgusting.
You can't send people to extra-judicial camps in a foreign country for minor but disgusting infractions like "public urination" and "illegal camping." If somebody craps their pants in your neighborhood and falls asleep in the bushes, that is gross. But they don't deserve to be sent to El Salvadorian prison for life.
We need real solutions, not the ideas of middle school boys or Nazis who say, "Jus' kill 'em."
p.s. The "there is nothing you can take from them" comment is spot on. You can't fine them $$$ or tow their car or embarrass them with social stigma. They have nothing.
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
It shouldn't surprise me that "send them to concentration camps" is somehow on the table of options at this point in our history. Disgusting.
You can't send people to extra-judicial camps in a foreign country for minor but disgusting infractions like "public urination" and "illegal camping." If somebody craps their pants in your neighborhood and falls asleep in the bushes, that is gross. But they don't deserve to be sent to El Salvadorian prison for life.
We need real solutions, not the ideas of middle school boys or Nazis who say, "Jus' kill 'em."
p.s. The "there is nothing you can take from them" comment is spot on. You can't fine them $ or tow their car or embarrass them with social stigma. They have nothing.
Many of them are essentially not even sentient beings. If you ask them “what is your name?” and “where are you right now?” they couldn’t provide a coherent answer.
What’s the difference between sleeping in a subway station and sleeping in an El Salvadoran facility for an individual who is essentially devoid of self-awareness?
Some of them are victims of a cruel society that requires corporate loyalty over principles, fake smiles, and has rigged rents and property values through exclusionary zoning.
The big one for me is the littering. Basically their day to day jobs are scouring dumpsters, private trash bins or even peoples property looking for things to build camps with. They build the camps on sidewalks, parks, public spaces, the city comes and tells them to move on and they literally do just that - up and off, crap everywhere - thanks mom and dad for cleaning up after me. Repeat cycle.
I've ofter wondered about going to a city council meeting with a bag of trash, setting up a little stall in a corner and then just walking off. I mean what's the difference?
Of course the real answer to this is guilt and shame. You have people in positions of power that know they have let down these people. They are making high six figure incomes doing f-all while people are living under piles of garbage on sidewalks. So it's much easier to just let them do what they want and convince yourself this is some kind of good samaritan, altruistic act of goodness you are contributing to and if it's not your property that directly suffers, you're fine with that.
Yes! In residential neighborhoods, they will come by the night before garbage collection and literally just rip open trash bags and throw the contents all over the sidewalk, leaving the homeowner to clean up after them like they're a bunch of children making a mess for their parents.
My parents live near a park and you’d have homeless people getting naked, camping out, doing drugs, having sex, and just other crazy things in the alley way behind their house, about a minute walk away from an elementary school. Not to mention just how dangerous they are. There have been 3-4 people in my city alone within the last year alone who’ve been killed after showing compassion to these people like letting them use their store bathroom or getting out of their car and trying to help them. Yet the police don’t care. The most annoying part is the littering, just trash everywhere and the city has given up to cleaning after that. So now you’ve got half of the city basically living in filth. The problem is that the people who make the laws lives in neighborhoods where they don’t have to deal with them. And I live in Arizona, I can’t imagine what people in blue states are going through.
Agree. But I am just really beginning to wonder if anything such things exist. Using Portland as an example, it's been really 5 years since this has become a gravely bad issue and there isn't one policy/solution out there that is anything close to something resembling a solution. "Central City Concern" actually exacerbates the problem. "Rapid Response Bio-Clean" is nothing more than a glorified maids clean-up service for homeless people.
The city tried to crack down on it and begin eliminating it in Wheelers final days as mayor and what happened? Somehow you had these people enlisting state lawyers on a pro-bono basis to overrule those orders on "humanitarian rights" basis. I mean what do you do? You hear all the time "it's lack of affordable housing". Affordable? You mean free? You said it - they have nothing. So what is the "affordable housing" solution exactly? A massive portion of these people are addicted to drugs or suffer from severe mental illness. Another portion have no interest in conforming to any societal norms and what, just giving them a free house and saying "here you go problem solved" is an answer?
I just don't know if there are real solutions anymore. It's like a cavity in your tooth. At some point you can manage it with better dental care and it won't exacerbate. Maybe it needs a filling. At some point it might get bad and need a root canal. But also it's a fact of reality that at some point the tooth is lost (and yeah this is where the metaphor gets weird but you get what I'm saying). Honestly I'm at the point where selfishly I just don't want to have to deal with this anymore. I don't want to be terrified every time I run past a blown out camper with tarps hanging off it that a captured dog isn't going to run out and take a chunk out of my leg. Or that I need to lock up my yard like Fort Knox to make sure some dude doesn't just cruise in and start going through my recycling on a Thursday night looking for cans to ultimately fund his fentanyl addiction.
I would do three things right now.
1) Enforce littering as a misdemeanor offense. Maybe the punishment isn't jail time as of course the police and courts are now dramatically underfunded because yeah, that was a great idea. But how about confiscation of the free mobile phones etc that we give these people? There has to be some incentive to not do this.
2) Can and bottle return for cash? Gone. You get issued a card that is linked to a utility bill or something like that. Return your cans and get a credit on your power bill. Don't have a power bill? Sorry - we can't fund your drug addictions with cans.
3) Simple one - reclaim stolen shopping carts. We know you stole them - you get grace for that but we need them back. You stop the mobility and ease at which people move their garbage around the city.
None of these things are specifically discriminatory to homeless/transient people. They apply equally to all citizens. If this makes it too tough to live in a place with such rules? Move on. I know this doesn't solve the real issue it's just moving it around - but what does? Some of these people are just gone and don't want help. Tragically many of them were gone from a young age and never even had a chance in life. Abused and neglected across a spectrum of ways. Born to people who had no place bringing life onto this planet in the first place. But how are you ever solving that sans some "George Orwell'ian sci-fi sh-t? We're not.
I think we are at the "just have to live with it" stage and the only solutions left are ways to limit your exposure to that.
It shouldn't surprise me that "send them to concentration camps" is somehow on the table of options at this point in our history. Disgusting.
You can't send people to extra-judicial camps in a foreign country for minor but disgusting infractions like "public urination" and "illegal camping." If somebody craps their pants in your neighborhood and falls asleep in the bushes, that is gross. But they don't deserve to be sent to El Salvadorian prison for life.
We need real solutions, not the ideas of middle school boys or Nazis who say, "Jus' kill 'em."
p.s. The "there is nothing you can take from them" comment is spot on. You can't fine them $ or tow their car or embarrass them with social stigma. They have nothing.
Many of them are essentially not even sentient beings. If you ask them “what is your name?” and “where are you right now?” they couldn’t provide a coherent answer.
What’s the difference between sleeping in a subway station and sleeping in an El Salvadoran facility for an individual who is essentially devoid of self-awareness?
The difference? Less rape and brutality in an American subway station than in a foreign prison populated with hardcore gangsters and sociopaths in uniforms.
About 10-15% of homeless are addicted. Another 10-15% are mentally ill. The majority are people that have fallen on very hard times due to a lack of skills, no local living wage jobs, divorce, priced out of rental housing, or dropped by the VA.
Many of you are a month or two of missed paychecks from the same fate. Remember that as the current President craters the economy and decimates your 401K.
It shouldn't surprise me that "send them to concentration camps" is somehow on the table of options at this point in our history. Disgusting.
You can't send people to extra-judicial camps in a foreign country for minor but disgusting infractions like "public urination" and "illegal camping." If somebody craps their pants in your neighborhood and falls asleep in the bushes, that is gross. But they don't deserve to be sent to El Salvadorian prison for life.
We need real solutions, not the ideas of middle school boys or Nazis who say, "Jus' kill 'em."
p.s. The "there is nothing you can take from them" comment is spot on. You can't fine them $ or tow their car or embarrass them with social stigma. They have nothing.
Many of them are essentially not even sentient beings. If you ask them “what is your name?” and “where are you right now?” they couldn’t provide a coherent answer.
What’s the difference between sleeping in a subway station and sleeping in an El Salvadoran facility for an individual who is essentially devoid of self-awareness?
The difference is one having tattoos, the other not. Basically you need to get a sharpie and draw lines and circles on their arms and necks; the US army will take care of the rest.
The difference? Less rape and brutality in an American subway station than in a foreign prison populated with hardcore gangsters and sociopaths in uniforms.
About 10-15% of homeless are addicted. Another 10-15% are mentally ill. The majority are people that have fallen on very hard times due to a lack of skills, no local living wage jobs, divorce, priced out of rental housing, or dropped by the VA.
Many of you are a month or two of missed paychecks from the same fate. Remember that as the current President craters the economy and decimates your 401K.
I agree that most deserve our empathy but there is a line between empathy and tolerance that trust me, if you live in a place badly affected by this, gets severely tested on a daily basis.
As for your %'ages? Much, much higher.
What you are absolutely correct about is the last sentence. The US is a scary place to live right now as this American dream of white picket fence capitalism has become a neoliberal sh-tstorm which has decimated the middle class and left so many people only a few missteps away from serious pain. But you keep voting for them (because the left is no better either.
The big one for me is the littering. Basically their day to day jobs are scouring dumpsters, private trash bins or even peoples property looking for things to build camps with. They build the camps on sidewalks, parks, public spaces, the city comes and tells them to move on and they literally do just that - up and off, crap everywhere - thanks mom and dad for cleaning up after me. Repeat cycle.
I've ofter wondered about going to a city council meeting with a bag of trash, setting up a little stall in a corner and then just walking off. I mean what's the difference?
Of course the real answer to this is guilt and shame. You have people in positions of power that know they have let down these people. They are making high six figure incomes doing f-all while people are living under piles of garbage on sidewalks. So it's much easier to just let them do what they want and convince yourself this is some kind of good samaritan, altruistic act of goodness you are contributing to and if it's not your property that directly suffers, you're fine with that.
Woke / progressive Democrats think that violent criminals and homeless are victims so they should be able to do whatever they want.
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