Broad Street 10 miler --too fast or what

what times?

pull the top 50 times...50 deep and still at 54s.

there was somewhat of a tailwind; 8 mph from the NNE. For a race running north to south that is definitely going to make times faster.

Sounds like a lot of runners owe us an apology.

I was just looking at these results and thinking how damn slowwwwwwww the top times were.

I ran 54:16 there before as a junior.

That year, there were 50 people under 51 minutes I believe, if not under 50 minutes...if not under 49 minutes!!

I doubt I was top 250 with a time of 54 minutes there.

The course is flat and fast. Times are way slower than they used to be. ALL of the times around the Philadelphia area are much slower than 20 years ago!!!!

For a race of 12000 people (finishers last year), they are relatively slow times. Please remember that World records have been set on this course. It does not seem downhill, surprised it is...if you say it is it is then...it is just flat and a big race around here with quality competition..only thing is a lot of the quality is missing currently...slow slow slow times!!!!

the race this year was significantly faster than any of the previous 5 years - usually 100th place is between 59:30 and 1:00:30, and this year it was 57:17. When did you run it that 250th place was around 54? that seems completely insane - must have been awesome to take part in.

I would agree, though, that the times in recent years have been pretty unimpressive for a 10000+ person race, especially considering the course is downhill (and it definitely is, about 160ft net drop, or 3 times the legal drop)

Sachs, is that you? How's the training? When's the next marathon?

Yes, this is Sachs...who is this??

I actually got my butt out the door today and did 15!!

Chopped 16 minutes off my best FATMAN time, but still ummm lets see, 18 minutes off my best time for this loop (if not more!!)

I was thinking about either the Delaware Marathon in two weeks, or better yet, doing the Old Dominion 50. Leaning towards the Old Dominion 50 miler as it is a trail run and would be more fun.

I tried three marathons in the last year...ok do not laugh!! Ran 3:22 or maybe it was 3:21 in Harrisburg...then the next week ran 3:21 in Philly..missed Boston by 15 seconds...tried one more time to make Boston in Greenbelt Md and the hills got me...I DNFed at around 15.5 miles.

Pretty sucky times.

So please do not laugh too loud. Who is this???

Well if you know me, you probably know Bala...he was supposed to run a marathon this weekend, but I think work picked up for him so I do not think he ran it. I think we are both around 3 hour shape (or lack of shape now)...although I need to prove my fatness in a marathon.

It was nice weather today around Philly. Easy to run. Wonder who this might be, maybe someone who ran across America???

MartyMoose wrote:[

Wonder who this might be, maybe someone who ran across America???

Sachs, it is me, Rogo. (You're sharp as ever.) Glad to hear you're getting some miles in....and convincin' Bala to do the same. That may be the bigger accomplishment.

Rogo!! Great!! How is your training going?

Hopefully I can get another training camp in with Bala in the very near future.

Last time, we did not run that much, but at least we got out the door daily. He has some peculiar and slow training partners (I was even too slow to hang with them...but have slightly improved since last fall)

Any chance you will be coming East this summer? There is a 100 miler in Vermont coming up soon.

I am 80% of the way to the Old Dominion 50. I truly have not put in many miles at all and should struggle greatly for being unprepared. But I will finish...

I race every weekend. Times usually suck. I keep waiting for it to come back...it never does... So it is finally dawning on me that maybe I need to try more INTENSITY, more MILES. If nothing else, the weight will come off...still fighting that battle!!

Good to see you, even if it is only here...

When is your next marathon or ultra?

I truly will run a few short ultras such as 50k and 50 miles this spring and summer. Why not, they still have them out there to do!!

I got 40th out of over 500 in my last trail race, a 15K. Not impressive, but slowly slowly slowly moving up. Either that, or the rest of the field is getting slower.

OD should kick my butt...it will be a great lesson though. At the worst I will finish..at the best be competitive. It is not the real OD...they will not let me in that one, need to do a practice 50 miler first. Got to start somewhere though.

Go Susan Loken...another fine Master's win!

I don't think this year's times were unreasonably fast as much as the past few years have been slow. it's been hot and/or into a headwind for about 3 years now. this year did have a tailwind, but I don't think many people PR'd by 2-3 minutes. the guys I know who were near the front of the race ran around what I think they are capable of running on a fast course. some ran PR's, but by 30sec - 1min, not 2-3min, and those PR's were expected because of better training in the past year. so to sum up my ramblings..

1) better weather than past years

2) tailwind

3) guys got themselves more fit than in previous years

i was there, ran like crap; but the weather was almost ideal, and there was a nice tailwind.

MartyMoose wrote:

I ran 54:16 there before as a junior.

That year, there were 50 people under 51 minutes I believe, if not under 50 minutes...if not under 49 minutes!!

give us the year--i call BS. i've run there several times, i ran my PR the same year the CR was set there, and there is NO WAY there were more than 50 people under 51 minutes, i promise.

I am 41 years old now. I have a nice plaque award from the 17-20 year age group on my wall, so it is about 22 years ago.

Times were EXTREMELY faster a generation ago in Philadelphia.

I used to routinely run 33 minutes in local 10K races and never win, or for that matter it was rare to place top 5, usually I was buried around 20th to 30th place in a stupid local road race.

Now, I am currently running about 40-41 minutes in 10Ks and the last 3 weeks I ran local races and placed in the top 5 in all 3 races. Times here absolutely suck now as compared to 20 years ago.

My friends and I look at old race results and compare them to times now and laugh.

You can do the same with the Broad Street run, times do not compare.

With regards to the Philly Marathon...if you compare times, times in the early to mid 80s were much much much much faster. I am talking about comparing the 200th time back in say 84 to the 50th place time in 2006 and the 200th time in 84 would be FASTER.

Only problem is..back then only 2000 people run the marathon. Now it is something like 7000.

So what is happening today is that running a marathon is more popular...

Running Broad Street is more popular...

Just people do not train like they used to train.

If you want to call bs you can...you can email me at

tienjem@msn.com

and I will find you old results so you can compare times yourself

As for my running...I suck now, I admit it. But I think I can drop 20 pounds and take a good five minutes off my 10K times in a season or two.

The times were faster a generation ago, at least in Philly. I would be curious as to the rest of the country.

I am noticing some local races getting more popular. Trail running seems to be more popular the last few years too.

However, the top times are not quality times, as compared to years gone by.

Seems to me more people are running races, but fewer people are actually runners. If you want, you can put me in that category, but at least I am still putting one foot in front of the other. However, what I wrote was not bs.

just a thought, but perhaps there's a lot more options as far as races go on any given weekend. not all the top guys are at the same races. i totally respect the generation before me but don't particularly agree with the sentiment that back in the day, everyone was faster and tougher. there's something to be learned from the guys that have been successful in the past, but the younger guys that are putting in the work and are just as "tough" should be given their due. i'll agree with you that there are a ton of non-runners out there just participating in the event. seriously, who cares? if you were top ten at broad street, your race consisted of 20-30 other guys, not 100 or 200 and definitely not 7000. those people were there but not part of that person's race.

i'm not calling bs, but i would be curious to see results if you could find them. comparison is always fun.

Yes, this is all true.

MartyMoose wrote:

The course is flat and fast. . . . Please remember that World records have been set on this course.

Incorrect on both counts. The course is not flat. It's downhill. And no world records have ever been set on that course, since you can't set world records on courses that are sharply downhill, point-to-point, and (generally) accompanied by a tailwind. This is just another ego-boosting race with no validity for PRs.

Certification # PA 99008 WB

The course is 10 miles, however does drop 158 feet. An avg of 16 ft/mile.

Yesterday was "perfect!" (though not for me who was out with a muscle strain).

I ran 2 years ago in a head wind and high humidity and placed 49th with a high 57. I think top 50 this year was under 54. Looks like I picked the wrong year to be injured = (