Trey Caldwell BREAKS Historical California XC Course Record!

It's "historic".

And who held the course record before he broke it?

Mitch Kingery San Carlos HS (closed).

Here is the history of the famed Crystal Springs Cross Country course:

http://lynbrooksports.prepcaltrack.com/ATHLETICS/XC/crybook.htm

Posted the following on the 2024 CIF thread -- with a change regarding Caldwell's time per below -- but is most appropriate here:

Actually, Caldwell may have only tied the CR as all Crystal Springs times are rounded up to the nearest second. However, it is unclear whether Kingrey's 14:28 from 1973 was actually 14:27.x, 14:28.0 or 14:28.x. So it will be up to the current Crystal Springs statistician(s) to resolve this little issue.

Note: Kingery also ran a 2:23:47 marathon in 1973 . . . as a sophomore . . . at the time the hs record.

Jay Marden ran 14:28.4 in 1980 which is rounded up to 14:29.

Thus, we now have three boys under 14:30 on this historic 2.95 mile course -- which is arguably the most challenging xc course in the nation given it's steep hills and uphill climb to the finish while offering only one 200 - 300 meter stretch of flat dirt surface to "recover" from climbing up the big hill.

Personally elated to see Crystal Springs back in the news, this time for good reasons. Unfortunate what almost happened four years ago when some locals tried to shut the place down.

For those interested in some Crystal Springs history, the "prehistoric" course was laid out in 1969 and ran all the way down past what is now I-280, then back up to the top of the start/finish hill. That course had to be abandoned after only one year due to construction of the interstate in 1970.

The current course configuration was laid out in 1971. However, slight modifications made at the bottom of the hill following the 1971 season may or may not have changed the distance. Thus, for record keeping purposes, the current 2.95 mile configuration opened in 1972 and has remained unchanged since. (Results from 1969 and 1971 races have been lost to time.)

Regarding the big picture, xc became popular in the US at the hs and college level in the late 1930s -- the first NCAA meet being held in 1938. The sport was primarily popular back then on the East Coast and Midwest.

Bring this up because, somewhere east of the Mississippi, there probably exists cross country venues that have been in use before 1970. (Van Cortland Park/NYC? Franklin Park/Boston? Detweiller Park/Peoria?) However, very much doubt there exists today a cross country course of 2.0 miles or longer which has not changed one iota since then and has course records tabulated to its beginnings.

So, what Trey Caldwell did today is remarkable, accomplished on a remarkable course, that in the somewhat insular world of US xc running, should be enshrined as a national treasure.

Congratulations!!!!!

Regardless, thank you for your insight, it seems like you really know your history and I appreciate you sharing it with me/us.

Mitch K. That's A blast from the past. If I remember correctly, he and Clancy Devery ran low 2:20s.

Those results are incorrect. The official results from the timing company show he ran 14:27.1. Maybe someone is trying to manually change the time to help give him the record.

https://www.rtspt.com/events/cif/2024Meets/serra/mp/#event7

You're wrong

Ok Chief. I guess the official results I posted are wrong and the unofficial results you posted are correct. Sounds good.👍

Much obliged for the kind words.

I ran Crystal Springs back in the day -- even attended the 1979 Kinney West Regional meet -- so hold a fondness and good memories for the venue.

In retrospect, pretty sure whomever now keeps Crystal Springs xc course records will recognize Trey's 14:27.1 as the new CR.

Kingery's 14:28 back in 1973 was hand timed by multiple officials, average time calculated, then either rounded up or rounded down. It should have been rounded up -- but we are 51 years too late to know for sure. Even if Mitch's averaged time was 14:27.x, unlikely it was 14:27.1.

So, kudos to Trey. Not often an athlete puts up a performance that breaks a record over a half-century old. Maybe this means his time will last until 2075😂.

Corrections: "prehistoric" course actually opened in 1965 and ran through 1969. Was 2.25 miles in length. All-time record list for those five years is actually tabulated in one of the Crystal Springs record book appendices linked in an earlier post.

https://lynbrooksports.prepcaltrack.com/ATHLETICS/XC/cryat_bi.htm

This argument over whether or not 14:27.1 will be recognized as the real record is the stupidest thing I've seen in a while. Of course it will. As someone who knows the de-facto record keeper of CCS, Hank Lawson, compiler of the times written above personally, I can tell you for a fact that he will recognize Caldwell's run as the new course record.

I'm sure Hank will "ratify" Trey's 14:27.1 as the new course record.

As the one who originally brought up the possibility of a tie, the reasoning spawns from the "prehistoric" days of manual stopwatch timing before Bob Rush -- Crystal Springs course architect -- invented the Chronomix electronic recording timer in 1977, thus allowing for the accurate recording of finishing times down to the 10th of a second with no need to round up or truncate.

Thus, even though it's highly unlikely Mitch ran a hand-timed 14:37.1 which was rounded up to 14:28, it's still statistically possible. It's also statistically possible he ran a hand-timed 14:28.9 which was truncated to 14:28. Unless Hank knows -- or one of Mitch's timers comes out of the woodwork 51 years later to clear up this minor mystery -- we'll likely never know.

As for stupidity, this question doesn't qualify. If you love stupid, go to any one of the Shelby, Jess Hull, Georgia Bell, or now Ruth Chepngetich threads to wallow in the mire the goons left behind.

The record is a bit soft. I ran mid 15s there 30 years ago and found it harder to break 16 a week later at the CA state meet. So I was ~70s off the CR at Crystal Springs, and ~90s off the CR at Woodward Park. German Fernandez would have run close to 14 flat.

I believe the VCP 2.5-mile course has not deviated since at least 1957 and has record history dating back until then; a very similar course has been run since 1913. I think the college 5-mile course has been the same for a similar or even longer period - not sure about the 5k as they used to run 3 miles.

How about this: I'll ask Bob at CCS. We'll clear this whole thing up then.

Is it really history if it is a different sport?

If someone set a record racing F1 on a trampoline track, would you act like it goes on lists with the asphault tracks?