I"m a junior that ran a 16:51 at the end of the Cross Country season on a decent course with one or two very slight uphill's. My prs from last track season are 4:57, 10:21, 2:03( from a 4 by 8 relay split.) and a 56 400m from a time trial mid season. How much effort would it take for me to hit my goals next year. I've ran purely on 15 to 25 mpw but I plan to bring that up to 40 or 50 during winter base
I"m a junior that ran a 16:51 at the end of the Cross Country season on a decent course with one or two very slight uphill's. My prs from last track season are 4:57, 10:21, 2:03( from a 4 by 8 relay split.) and a 56 400m from a time trial mid season. How much effort would it take for me to hit my goals next year. I've ran purely on 15 to 25 mpw but I plan to bring that up to 40 or 50 during winter base
16:51 on a moderate course isn't too far off from a sub-10 equivalent as is, and if you've run those times off 15-25mpw you should have more than enough talent to run the times you want off that kind of an increase in volume. Just be careful - practically doubling your mileage is risky and you might be better off training slightly more conservatively at 35-40 if you find yourself on the verge of injury at 40-50. You can always bump up to 50 your senior year if you've proven your body can handle the volume.
I"m a junior that ran a 16:51 at the end of the Cross Country season on a decent course with one or two very slight uphill's. My prs from last track season are 4:57, 10:21, 2:03( from a 4 by 8 relay split.) and a 56 400m from a time trial mid season. How much effort would it take for me to hit my goals next year. I've ran purely on 15 to 25 mpw but I plan to bring that up to 40 or 50 during winter base
16:51 on a moderate course isn't too far off from a sub-10 equivalent as is, and if you've run those times off 15-25mpw you should have more than enough talent to run the times you want off that kind of an increase in volume. Just be careful - practically doubling your mileage is risky and you might be better off training slightly more conservatively at 35-40 if you find yourself on the verge of injury at 40-50. You can always bump up to 50 your senior year if you've proven your body can handle the volume.
Should I do doubles to increase my mileage more safely? I feel as if I am extremely aerobically undertrained. I've noticed that 6:45-7:20 mile pace is about my threshold which seems far too high in comparison to my prs
You need to get to a place to justify doubles before doubling imo. I don't think it's safer to run twice a week from what you described.
As far as your goals go, mileage should held. The 2:03, even on a relay split, is a good bit stronger than everything else. 16:51 shows decent strength. Sub-2 is stronger than 4:35/sub-10. 4:35 is a little stronger than 10:00. You seem primed for some big improvements after a good cross season. Build the mileage. Keep it easy until you get to where you want to hang out at. Bring in some quality. Race.
You need to get to a place to justify doubles before doubling imo. I don't think it's safer to run twice a week from what you described.
As far as your goals go, mileage should held. The 2:03, even on a relay split, is a good bit stronger than everything else. 16:51 shows decent strength. Sub-2 is stronger than 4:35/sub-10. 4:35 is a little stronger than 10:00. You seem primed for some big improvements after a good cross season. Build the mileage. Keep it easy until you get to where you want to hang out at. Bring in some quality. Race.
What type of quality should I incorporate when I've reached a mileage I can hold safely
if the goal is college, how do you see yourself? distance guy who does 3k/5k/XC? mid distance guy who does 800/mile but also XC for training/to help out? because for college recruiting purposes you need to think about which ones of these do you enjoy and think you would be best at? because while this is an interesting wish list it's kind of scattershot spaghetti on the wall. what is your focus?
i say this because while senior XC matters, your junior TF season is the last one a recruiting coach may see the times for. by fall/winter 2024 you are applying; by spring 2025 you may already be making decisions.
to me you look closest to doing something in the 800/3200. the XC time is ok. your mile time is weird ie i was faster than that as a sprinter/hurdler messing around. i'd think you'd be faster. maybe you don't run it often. i would definitely be chasing some goals but i would pick an end of the spectrum to emphasize. i am a half mile/mile guy, mid-distance, chase your sub 2 800 and a better mile. or i am a XC/long distance guy, mile and 2 mile and work on the XC time more. throwing it all out there, i am sure you get some of it done, but to what end?
i say this, when i was talking with coaches senior year, for soccer it was, i am a wing/defender. and they got it. for track i would give a list of times and while that's nice and gives them room, if i could do it again i'd have researched what my best times were for the intended level, and shaped a selling point. my best events to colleges actually should have been quarter and low hurdles. what was i running senior year? relays/100/200. not in my best events and if i just list a half dozen times maybe they go to sleep.
and you don't literally have to make a decision now, but you might have a direction by when TF meets start. just my 2 cents.
i mean like with these training plans, the end of the spectrum you focus on would push the training in a direction. fast 400/800/mile vs. fast 2 mile/5k/18k/10k are different training. as someone who ran XC a few years i thought XC took some of my top gear away. sheer mileage doesn't give you a kick in a short race. might run that gear off you. but if the plan is run 2, 3, 5, 6.2 miles, so what.
if the goal is college, how do you see yourself? distance guy who does 3k/5k/XC? mid distance guy who does 800/mile but also XC for training/to help out? because for college recruiting purposes you need to think about which ones of these do you enjoy and think you would be best at? because while this is an interesting wish list it's kind of scattershot spaghetti on the wall. what is your focus?
i say this because while senior XC matters, your junior TF season is the last one a recruiting coach may see the times for. by fall/winter 2024 you are applying; by spring 2025 you may already be making decisions.
to me you look closest to doing something in the 800/3200. the XC time is ok. your mile time is weird ie i was faster than that as a sprinter/hurdler messing around. i'd think you'd be faster. maybe you don't run it often. i would definitely be chasing some goals but i would pick an end of the spectrum to emphasize. i am a half mile/mile guy, mid-distance, chase your sub 2 800 and a better mile. or i am a XC/long distance guy, mile and 2 mile and work on the XC time more. throwing it all out there, i am sure you get some of it done, but to what end?
i say this, when i was talking with coaches senior year, for soccer it was, i am a wing/defender. and they got it. for track i would give a list of times and while that's nice and gives them room, if i could do it again i'd have researched what my best times were for the intended level, and shaped a selling point. my best events to colleges actually should have been quarter and low hurdles. what was i running senior year? relays/100/200. not in my best events and if i just list a half dozen times maybe they go to sleep.
and you don't literally have to make a decision now, but you might have a direction by when TF meets start. just my 2 cents.
I think your right about me being stronger in the 3200 and 800. I only ran the mile four times my sophmore year so that might be the reason its not up to par with my other times. Honestly I have no idea of what kind of runner I'd like to be in college. I know I need to hone in on that at some point but my goal is to be an all around decent runner my Junior year and get some D2 qualifying times or maybe try and walk onto some low end D1 school
To be completely honest if I had to chose today I'd rather focus on the mile and above. My coach said he'd put me in the events I perform the best in this season so I'll see how it all falls together
Do you have a coach? This time of year I like tempo/threshold stuff. You're trying to expand your aerobic capacity as much as you can so you have a good foundation for the spring track season. Trying to do too many hard workouts while increasing your mileage could leave you injured or burned out. You can race well during indoors even if you haven't brought in a ton of speed. I think there are some HS (& college) coaches who fall into the trap of doing race specific workouts year round.
I had very similar times to you in the 1600 and 3200 my junior year, but never ran the 800 (this was 40 years ago, not that it matters). Hit the weights over the winter 2-3x per week. Also, make sure you get in a weekly long run of 10-12 miles at an easy pace, and try to get in a minimum of 50 mpw. The little things like diet and esp. sleep make a difference. I stuck to this routine during the winter from December through March, and ran 4:33 and 9:56 in the Spring. Not blazing times (even back them), but pretty decent for a kid going to a small, rural high school with a cinder track!
here's the deal. my final 2 schools i decided between the applications these days are due Jan 15 and Feb 1. senior spring grades don't tend to matter a lot as long as you graduate. the admissions folks are looking at your grades before you turned your application in. likewise, senior track times are also less influential. your application may already be turned in. maybe the coach can put a late word in or maybe not. maybe the school has an unusually late application deadline or some scholarships or roster room left. but IMO a lot of places you're shopping junior spring TF times and senior fall XC times.
I was in the same boat as you. I ran 16:51 my sophomore year on a legit course with similar mileage. I went 4:39/10:17 that track season. It even looks like we have similar speed I ran 57 400 IF you ask me I was definitely worth a sub 10 that season. I ran a 4:41/10:17 double in a span of 30 minutes. I knew runners more talented than me making similar or even bigger jumps from XC to track Another sophomore on my team went 4:34/10:00 running similar mileage(50 mpw). I think if you could already run 10:21 simply increasing mileage will most likely get you in the 10:0x range without a crazy amount more of speedwork. My suggestion is increase the mileage gradually(maybe 10-13 more miles more per week depending on your legs) and towards the end of the season do some key turnover workouts when you drop in mileage.
If you trajectory is like mine I went 16:06 the next xc season and then 9:58/4:33. hope it helps. Oh and Weights and long runs are unskippable in my opinion..