This might be a controversial take, but 5 miles is too long for high school athletes. They don't need to run longer than 20 min for a tempo run.
Some high school private coaches are posting on social media that their athletes are doing 5 mile tempo runs (or longer) averaging around 5:30. That's 27.5 minutes. They have girls doing 30x30 seconds.
Those coaches also have the worst reputations as their athletes do not run well in college. RunCCG athletes have a terrible track record in college. College coaches know to watch out for them.
High school coaches - think long term. Don't burn out your athletes.
Every athlete is different. I think with a kid, especially if they have talent, the main goal is to get them to college happy and healthy and enjoying running.
Kids with less talent may have to push the envelope more in training, but for most kids 50-60 mpw is fine for junior and senior year boys and 40-45 mpw for girls that age as well. As for tempos, I think for someone running that kind of mileage 3-4 miles would be fine. For someone so young, I'd recommend cruise intervals over tempo. For a HS kid, running 5-6 x 1k at LT with 90 seconds rest is probably plenty.
This might be a controversial take, but 5 miles is too long for high school athletes. They don't need to run longer than 20 min for a tempo run.
Some high school private coaches are posting on social media that their athletes are doing 5 mile tempo runs (or longer) averaging around 5:30. That's 27.5 minutes. They have girls doing 30x30 seconds.
Those coaches also have the worst reputations as their athletes do not run well in college. RunCCG athletes have a terrible track record in college. College coaches know to watch out for them.
High school coaches - think long term. Don't burn out your athletes.
Yes, those extra 7 minutes will certainly burn them out.
I did it. This was more than 40 years ago, and not many particular workouts stick in my mind. As in, still remember that exact day. Anyway, one that does was a 5-mile tempo. It was pouring rain. I remember huge puddles on the bike trail and there were some other guys out there that day whom I didn't recognize.
Well, that's why I posted. Saw the title and said to myself, " Hey, I did 5- mile tempos in high school. I can still remember that one in the rain...."
Pretty sure Jakob, Kipchoge, and Bekele were all doing well over 5 min tempos aged 14-18. Sucks the all burned out and never improved after high school age
This might be a controversial take, but 5 miles is too long for high school athletes. They don't need to run longer than 20 min for a tempo run.
Some high school private coaches are posting on social media that their athletes are doing 5 mile tempo runs (or longer) averaging around 5:30. That's 27.5 minutes. They have girls doing 30x30 seconds.
Those coaches also have the worst reputations as their athletes do not run well in college. RunCCG athletes have a terrible track record in college. College coaches know to watch out for them.
High school coaches - think long term. Don't burn out your athletes.
Jakob can do 4 sets of 5 mile tempos per workout session and still has enough energy to shoot pool with his boys and take some shots of kettle one.
I did it. This was more than 40 years ago, and not many particular workouts stick in my mind. As in, still remember that exact day. Anyway, one that does was a 5-mile tempo. It was pouring rain. I remember huge puddles on the bike trail and there were some other guys out there that day whom I didn't recognize.
Well, that's why I posted. Saw the title and said to myself, " Hey, I did 5- mile tempos in high school. I can still remember that one in the rain...."
I did it. This was more than 40 years ago, and not many particular workouts stick in my mind. As in, still remember that exact day. Anyway, one that does was a 5-mile tempo. It was pouring rain. I remember huge puddles on the bike trail and there were some other guys out there that day whom I didn't recognize.
Well, that's why I posted. Saw the title and said to myself, " Hey, I did 5- mile tempos in high school. I can still remember that one in the rain...."
"bike trails" didn't exist 40 years ago
I guess I didn't exist, too bad all those high school and college runners weren't running on me.
This might be a controversial take, but 5 miles is too long for high school athletes. They don't need to run longer than 20 min for a tempo run.
Some high school private coaches are posting on social media that their athletes are doing 5 mile tempo runs (or longer) averaging around 5:30. That's 27.5 minutes. They have girls doing 30x30 seconds.
Those coaches also have the worst reputations as their athletes do not run well in college. RunCCG athletes have a terrible track record in college. College coaches know to watch out for them.
High school coaches - think long term. Don't burn out your athletes.
If only because high school athletes run them too hard, I agree. If they were actually controlled tempos and not near races, I would say 30 min is about right.
This is where I would say Tinman mostly has it correct. Higher volume but lower intensity CV workouts and tempos, and you can keep an athlete improving on a steady trajectory without burnout. It’s the intensity that kills.
I would err on the side of higher volume near 60-80 mpw but less intense workouts to keep them in the game.
I guess I didn't exist, too bad all those high school and college runners weren't running on me.
OK, so I come back a while later and find a poster who wasn't buying my story. Then, another poster backs me up....using the exact same trail as an example! For what it's worth, the tempo in question was from about the current 20 mile mark to the 15. This was that exact run on the particular day that sticks in my mind - not my only run on that trail.
Now, for those of you who know the area, you may know it wasn't always a 31-mile-plus trail. It was 2 different trails prior to the bridge connecting Goethe Park (called something else now - maybe River Bend Park) with William Pond Park. Basically connecting Rancho Cordova and Carmichael. If I am remembering accurately, the bridge was built in '79 or '80.
So, Discovery Park to the site of the current bridge was and is 13-1/2 miles. Then on the other side, you could only go as far as Hazel Ave. for a while. So that was a 9 mile stretch. This is where most of my teenage running took place. So, that's why I said the 'current' 15-20 mile markers since the Rancho section of trail at the time had it's own markers that predated the unification of the trails. Eventually, trails went along both sides of Lake Natomas, but it would be sometime in the '80s before that existed. Not sure when it made it to Granite Bay for it's current length.
At any rate, the trail existed in the early '70s that I'm aware of. Not sure how much earlier than that. Great route and very popular more than 40 years ago (when somebody claimed it didn't exist) and now.
I am still concerned about this 30x30 sec fartlek workout you said they do. How could an athlete ever recover from 15 minutes of hard running. 15 minutes!
I'm surprised parents allow their kids to run that long. I bet those athletes run more than 30 miles per week too. Next thing you know they will be running 6 or 7 days a week.
I've coached 3 runners under 4:30 for the mile and we never did more than 25 miles in a week. I don't know much about this RunCCG team, I doubt they have had that kind of success
It depends on the caliber of the athlete. Some of the top kids in the country in high school are doing 4-10mile tempos. I don’t even know what burnout means…. Is the goal to get them to college? If yes it sounds like they did the job. If they aren’t coaching them in college should we be blaming the college coaches? Sounds like this is someone who is a competitor to these coaches.
If high school kid can run a 5 mile tempo at 5:30 min miles, then they are definitely able to handle that kind of workout in their training load. It may be a fair point that kids who would average 6:30 for a 5 mi tempo might do better with a shorter tempo. But if a HS kid is fast enough to rattle off 5:30s at a tempo effort, 5 miles is probably spot on.
Of course, the real issue is whether these kids are doing it at a tempo effort or whether they are going to the well and racing it all out. If it is the later, the problem isn't as much the distance as it is the coaching. And the bigger issue for HS kids is not any particular workout being too much. It is whether the kids understand the effort level and the purpose of the workout instead of making everything into a race or trying to blow away your times on the same workout that you did at the beginning of the season or last year, etc.
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